Trying to merge [11 January 2014]
Hello Jennifer ! I have a problem with this ! Please can you make something ? Cleanup or unmerge ? Thank you ! I don't "work" about theses families, but I found ... "doublons" (duplicate records) ! Amicalement - Marc ROUSSEL - --Markus3 09:44, 2 January 2014 (UTC)
Yes, please demonstrate sources and citations on one of my files so I can learn to do it. Many thanks for your help.
EKBDVA--EKBDVA 22:46, 11 January 2014 (UTC)
The difference between Sources and Citations [19 January 2014]
I am still not clear on the difference between a source (I know it is global) and a citation. As an example: why is the Census year 1880 not the source; and the information about the city, county, state, and persons counted not the citation? An example would help clear it up for me.
Many thanks EKBDVA--EKBDVA 20:27, 18 January 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for trying Jrich, but that didn't help me much. But I plan to copy it and save so I can refer back to it. EKBDVA--EKBDVA 19:52, 19 January 2014 (UTC)
Yes, but it did help me! I keep seeing others use citation where I use source and I couldn't figure out the difference. For an example see bottom of Person:Hope Washburn (1). From your description, it looks to me like the author of the citations could have used sources instead and still put the extra info in the text window. Hmm but these citations are blue links to a source. So maybe I'm still confused. --janiejac 20:32, 19 January 2014 (UTC)
Mary A. Drinkwater death date [22 January 2014]
It looks like someone edited the source after I changed it from "my source" to "Source". How does it look now? I made some edits too.
EKBDVA--EKBDVA 20:45, 22 January 2014 (UTC)
Wikipedia Template change [28 January 2014]
Hi Jennifer, I noticed you updated the page of Vincent Lombardi. With your change, will the wikipedia content populate on his Person Page on the next refresh? I was hoping that it would populate on his page prior to this Friday (I was going to put him as the Featured Page on Friday through the Superbowl). Otherwise, I'll manually add some of his wikipedia content on Friday....
Let me know.
Thanks and have a great week,
Jim:)--Delijim 23:21, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
Lombardi Page [28 January 2014]
I've sort of tossed the page together with a few WR goodies - place page for the Cemetery, GIS coordinates for the burial lot within the cemetery, and references to a number of WP pages associated with education and occupation events - but I'm most definitely not an expert here. Someone should review my work, and we should definitely get census records in where we can. --jrm03063 17:36, 28 January 2014 (UTC)
Thanks to both of you for the updates:) I'll try to add a few records before I post it sometime tomorrow or Thursday. Thought it might be nice to have WeRelate get into the Super Bowl "hype", too... :)
Pietje Annes (Mug) (Zondervan) date of death [28 January 2014]
Regarding, Pietje Annes Mug Zondervan
death shown as; d.26 APR 1803 Sint Jacobiparochie, Het Bildt, Friesland, Netherlands
What is the original source of this date of death?
According to the inventory of Tresoar, registration of death (burial) in St. Jacobieparochie is only available in the DTB 118, Het Bildt - Burgerlijk book after 1806.
Het Bildt - Hervormde gemeente - St. Jacobiparochie 122. Doopboek, 1748-1812. Indices: DTB nr. 130c. 123. Trouwboek, 1650-1772. Indices: DTB nrs. 130a en 130b. 124. Lidmatenboek, 1760-1850.
Index: DTB nr. 130e. N.B. Zie ook: Copie elders 6164 op de studiezaal.
Het Bildt - Burgerlijk 116-117.
Registers van afkondiging en bevestiging van huwelijken door het Gerecht, 1607-1717. Indices: DTB 130a en 130b. 116. 1607-1640 117. 1642-1717
118. Register van overledenen, 1806-1811.
Index: DTB nr. 1025d.--John Terpstra 18:56, 28 January 2014 (UTC)
Hi John, I didn't add the date of death for Person:Pietje Zondervan (4), another user Cabrioot did. I'll leave a message on Pietje's talk page regarding your question. Please go to Pietje's page and click "Watch" from the menu on the left so that you can be notified of his answer. --Jennifer (JBS66) 19:04, 28 January 2014 (UTC)
Thanks Jennifer, I will watch for a reply.--John Terpstra 21:21, 28 January 2014 (UTC)
A GEDCOM we might want to consider removing [15 February 2014]
I ran across a user who loaded a couple of GEDCOMs in 2008-2009 that, at least from the parts I looked at, were heavily influenced by OneWorldTree, which made a real mess of the data (e.g., James Board married his own mother, Thomas Stewart was the son of parents married 300 years before he was born and died in the US 30 years before he was in a census in Scotland). I started trying to find better data, and added citations to a couple of marriages in the Board family, but trying to straighten out this data appears to be more trouble than it is worth (it hasn't been easy finding reliable sources online). Can we get these GEDCOMs removed (other than where they merge with pages other users are watching)? I "unwatched" the couple of pages I updated so that they are not left as orphans (it doesn't bother me if my small contribution of adding dates and sources is deleted).
This data represents the worst of what OneWorldTree did to the genealogy world, and I'd hate to have people say that WeRelate is an unreliable site (or worse, that it is junk) because it contains this kind of garbage.--DataAnalyst 01:58, 31 January 2014 (UTC)
What are the qualifications to help with such a review? Thx, Ron--woepwoep 18:09, 4 February 2014 (UTC)
The report is now available at WeRelate:Old GEDCOMs. I like the idea of picturing this as 'triage'. How about we continue discussions on this talk page and be sure to watch that page if you are interested in participating in this project. --Jennifer (JBS66) 16:37, 15 February 2014 (UTC)
How to find out which one is true? [13 feb 2014]
pls see Person:Hendrina_Heesen_(1) i found two records, what do they mean? is the first one birth and the second one Doop ?
thx, R--woepwoep 08:40, 12 February 2014 (UTC)
thx ! R--woepwoep 08:52, 13 February 2014 (UTC)
ps i use Chrome too, blank screen, clicking on Download PDF and then opening the PDF works for me.
Correct displaying of an image [20 February 2014]
Hello Jennifer ! Please, what is wrong ? ... Person:Armand Savard (1) --> The image does exist : Image:Armand Savard, fils de François.JPG An other example : Person:Margaret Orr (12) - Thank you ! Amicalement - Marc ROUSSEL - --Markus3 08:23, 17 February 2014 (UTC)
A relatively new user created a page for a member of a family of interest to me; he references an image which does not appear on the page. Could it be the same problem? Person:Clarence Ritsema (2). (I did not see an image in his recent uploads. So it might be a different problem.) --Pkeegstra 13:46, 17 February 2014 (UTC)
can it be related to an error in mediawiki ? http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension_talk:PDFThumbnails--woepwoep 16:59, 17 February 2014 (UTC)
Dallan has fixed this bug. In each case, the problem was related to "special" characters (such as the ç in François). Now, when images are uploaded, the file names will be automatically converted to change characters like ç into c. The only fix for existing images with errors, however, is for the user to delete the image and re-upload it. --Jennifer (JBS66) 18:22, 20 February 2014 (UTC)
re WeRelate:Old GEDCOMs [21 February 2014]
Much as though getting rid of old GEDCOMs which are lacking in quality sounds like a worthwhile project, I don't feel I should get involved in a serious way.
As you know I am a bit of "geographical genealogist" and have been working on improving (hopefully) place pages for the past year and a half. Currently the location is Yorkshire, England, which could hold more places within it than any other state/province-equivalent in the world. Progress so far stands at about the 50% mark and I haven't lost my motivation yet.
When I need a break I look at "who links here" and start inspecting and correcting red-lettered places and reading other people's trees. That was how I found User:twestern yesterday. He/she knew about sources, but not how to add them. I had a feeling that if more research had been done some of the families found in the census would have been discarded. Because we can't see English bmd registrations without paying about $15 each for them it's difficult to back up census information with vitals. To do that for all branches of a family in the 19th century is a costly process.
With regard to the old GEDCOMs project, I feel I had better stay on the outside, but I know that if I come across a highly sus tree I can advise you. What are the next steps for those you have accumulated?
Regards, Pat --Goldenoldie 07:44, 21 February 2014 (UTC)
Francis Cooke/Hester Mahieu [22 February 2014]
Hi Jennifer, I'm looking for what I think is a Dutch marriage record. Here's the clue I have:
The marriage at Leyden in 1603 is recorded in the "Kerkelijke Houwelijke", Liber E. Folio 69. The date isn't given but it was probably 30 June 1603. It reads (translated into English), "Francis Cooke, woolcomber, unmarried, from England, accompanied bu Philip De Veau and Raphael Roelandt, his acquintances, with Hester Mahieu, unmarried, from Canterbury in England, accompanied by Jennie Mahieu, her mother, and Jennie Mahieu, her sister."
Can you give me any hints on where I might look? :-)--Frank 03:18, 22 February 2014 (UTC)
I had a look at http://www.archiefleiden.nl which has records of the DTB's. Franchoys Couck & Hester Mahieu's ondertrouw (marriage license) 4 Jul 1603 A scan of the certificate is here 069v I added a few notations below in brackets:
Thanks for the great input. The scan was exactly what I was looking for. Do you all think it would be of interest to put it on the family page as an image? Don't want to clutter things up, but I personally find these old images to be of great interest. Just wish I could read them - Google Translate doesn't read cursive so well.. UPDATE: Exploring the site further, I'm not sure if using the image is ok. Looks like they charge for large images and other formats, but no mention is made of the web version. Since my Dutch is non-existent, thought I'd better ask if you know...--Frank 14:38, 22 February 2014 (UTC)
Thanks! Have to admit I was wondering if the translation in my original message to you was accurate so a "read" on that would be great if it happens at some point. I'd also like to include your notations with the image if ok with you. I think they help us English speakers out immensely.--Frank 16:51, 22 February 2014 (UTC)
Bad marriage date [28 February 2014]
Hello Jennifer ! Please see this record : Person:John McMillan (4) ... first marriage 1858, death Jan 1901 and second marriage Aug 1903. What can we do ? Leave a message on the talk page of the contributor (his last edit = 8 January 2009) ? Add a "note in red" saying "bad date" ont the record ? Simply delete this date ? - Amicalement - Marc ROUSSEL - --Markus3 08:47, 26 February 2014 (UTC)
An other problem [28 February 2014]
Jennifer ! I want to clean up this record : Other? 01 AUG 2004 Record Change
Ancestral File Number [2 March 2014]
Hello Jennifer ! I try to clean up all records with "Other : Record change ...". I saw many records with this tag "Ancestral File Number" that I have sometimes deleted ! I discover that it can be (but not always) a reference with the site of the Mormons ! I have 2 questions :
Thank you ! Amicalement - Marc ROUSSEL - --Markus3 15:57, 2 March 2014 (UTC)
Stupid link to a village in Aisne (France) [4 March 2014]
Hello, Jennifer ! Please see my message here ---> Why Place:Vailly-sur-Aisne, Aisne, France ---> problem with the automatic gedcom import ? Two months ago I found an other "stupid link" for plenty of records ... but I don't know more exactly what was this "wrong place" ! Amicalement - Marc ROUSSEL - --Markus3 07:44, 4 March 2014 (UTC)
when names change in writing, what name to use when creating a person record? [7 March 2014]
i am working on Person:Hinnerse_Nieuwenhuis_(1) her name is written in at least four different variations.
now i wonder what name to use as the WR official name? (1) her name at birth? (2) her name at death? (3) her name as a mother of the bride or groom?
do you have a standard way of working? thx, Ron--woepwoep 17:05, 7 March 2014 (UTC)
Comparing 2 Reitsma-Bakker families [17 March 2014]
Hi, I was working on the Duplicate Families backlog, and encountered this comparison of 2 Reitsma-Bakker families. It seems you uploaded all the people involved a few years ago (if I have read the history correctly). The one major relevant change not done by you was that Person:Jitske Reitsma (4) was placed as a child into the family Family:Liebe Reitsma and Idske Bakker (1), which was done by User:Kdrost. Kdrost did not remove Jitske from Family:Liebe Reitsma and Jelske Bakker (1) so Jitske has two sets of parents.
It may be that these two families are duplicates of each other and should be merged. But maybe Person:Idske Bakker (2) is distinct from Person:Jelske Bakker (2), and there are two distinct marriages, in which case I or someone should mark them "nomerge". I expect that you will have some insight into the situation and can indicate how this should be fixed. Thanks. --robert.shaw 05:53, 16 March 2014 (UTC)
In the Alle Friezen (marriage record) the name of Idske Bakker is wrongry mentioned as Jetske Bakker. In the scan her name is Idske. Today I send a mail to Alle Friezen about this mistake. I think we can remove the name Jelske in werelate.
--paulsnip 10:16, 16 March 2014 (UTC) Paul Snip
Eerbeek part of Brummen? [17 mrt 2014]
in Person http://www.werelate.org/wiki/Person:Everdina_Havekes_%281%29 the town of Eerbeek is gemeente Brummen (1871) should Place http://www.werelate.org/wiki/Place:Eerbeek%2C_Gelderland%2C_Netherlands be renamed?
thx, R--woepwoep 09:21, 17 March 2014 (UTC)
thx !--woepwoep 11:49, 17 March 2014 (UTC)
Researching Smeryczanski for my family tree [21 March 2014]
I am looking for some information about my family history. Like mnay of these journies I have arrived here with little information after many relatives have passed. So I dont know much. My search in Google has lead me to this web site and your page. I am curious what infomation you may have found.
Here is what I know. My Grandmother was married to a Michael Smeryczanski and had my dad. Apparently thier relationship was brief and he left. My grandmother soon remarried and never told my dad that the man who raised him was not his father. Well, not until he graduated high school and she was worried that he may be in trouble with the draft if they ever called his name.
What I do know about this lineage is that Michael's parents were probably John and Ann(a) and he had siblings possibly Mary, Joesph, Bernard and Catherine. Michael was born in 1926(7) here in the US but his parents were born elswhere and came through Ellis Island as kids.
I would like to know more about the origins of this part of my family. I see that your records show a Jan (John) that was born in Austria. This seems an unusual name for an Austrian. But I may not know much.
Any info you could share I would greatly appreciate.
Allison Hurd--Urania8 05:59, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
Ellis records show this:
First Name: Jan Last Name: Smericzanski Ethnicity: Austria, Polish Last Place of Residence: Czernowitz, Austria Date of Arrival: Jun 10, 1910 Age at Arrival: 27y Gender: M Marital Status: M Ship of Travel: Pennsylvania Port of Departure: Hamburg Manifest Line Number: 0029
woepwoep 06:23, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
Thank you so much. We have had some issues with the spelling. Even my grandmother completely misspelled it. Eventually my paternal grandfather (Jan/John would have been HIS grandfather) changed it to Shayne. This matches up with enough of the information that I have. Does that make him ethnically Austrian? Maybe you know? Thanks again!--Urania8 05:11, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
Austrian element should be interpreted in wide sense of the word as it included not only Austrians or Germans, but also the German-speaking society. Those people moved here from the whole Austrian Empire: Bohemia, Moravia (Czech Republic), Trieste or Hungary. This turned a provincial town of Bukovyna into the farthest eastern outpost of the Austrian Empire.
The Jan that came to the U.S. in 1910 is Person:Jan Smereczanski (1). The Passenger List shows that his wife was Weronika and that his destination was his brother Josef (who I believe may be my great grandfather).
The name for my Smereczanski line changed a lot in the U.S. There was Sherman, Shermansky, Hoffman, Delgran, Clements, Smoren...
I have a few other lines on WR as well that I've not yet connected to my family.. There is another branch that I haven't found a connection with, nor have I entered them into WeRelate. They settled in Salem, MA and information about them can be found here.
I would love to be able to create pages here on WeRelate for your Smereczanski branch (note WeRelate only allows pages to be created for non-living individuals). Where in the U.S. did Michael Smeryczanski live? Do you have any more information about his possible siblings? --Jennifer (JBS66) 10:47, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
Gaanderen part of Doetinchem? [20 mrt 2014]
i am adding someone in Gaanderen, which i believe is a part of gemeente Doetinchem or Ambt Doetinchem. can you help ? according to http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ambt_Doetinchem Gaanderen was Ambt Doetinchem in 1900
thx, Ron--woepwoep 13:28, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
thx ! R--woepwoep 15:51, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
moving persons and families between trees [24 March 2014]
i came up with the idea to have my one - default - tree split up into eight, one for each of my great-grandparents. how do i move persons and families between trees?
thx, Ron--woepwoep 08:42, 24 March 2014 (UTC)
I don't understand [25 March 2014]
Place:Mossel (Bronckhorst) [27 mrt 2014]
hi Jennifer, can you help me out?
person died in Mossel(Bronckhorst) http://www.werelate.org/wiki/Person:Engelbart_Severt_%281%29
which gemeente was this? probably Ruurlo ?
thx, Ron--woepwoep 06:42, 27 March 2014 (UTC)
double church marriage record [3 apr 2014]
sorry to bother you again. can you pls check http://www.werelate.org/wiki/Family:Jan_Bokkers_and_Harmina_Rooks_%281%29
i found two dates, in two different churches, of their marriage.
are both true?
thx, Ron--woepwoep 14:05, 2 April 2014 (UTC)
Renaming a source page [3 April 2014]
Attempting to correct an error that I made in naming a source page. However the system will not allow me to rename this source page Source:Georgia, United States. Georgia, United States. Georgia, Death Index, 1933-1998. What am I doing wrong? --Beth 14:44, 3 April 2014 (UTC)
Nevermind Jennifer, I was able to rename the page this time. --Beth 16:06, 3 April 2014 (UTC)
The profit ? [7 April 2014]
Jennifer what is the profit of this addition. Vorden remains to be found on page >3.
With this * example, it will be different. Groetjes, --Lidewij 19:03, 7 April 2014 (UTC)
removing a marriage [8 April 2014]
I like to remove Kathlyntje as a spouse from Person:Bartholomeus_Vrooman_(7) because she appears as a duplicate mother for Hendrick Meese Vrooman and I see no proof for her existence elsewhere on the web. Can you help? I checked the help pages on site, but only found information on adding and editing persons, not delete.
The marriage of Bartholomeus Vrooman and Ariaantgen Hendrix appears in lots of places on the web, and even though I haven't found direct sources anywhere, I am inclined to keep them, because I assume that they appear in immigrant pedigrees, some of which may be added as a sort of source later.
I assume that I can remove Kathlyntje by editing the family, and then ask for Speedy Delete of the family page, but I don't know if that's the right way, so I ask you, because you did another delete today. I'm also ok with just unlinking Hendrick from the other family, if that looks better to you, but for that too, I can't find how to do that on the help pages.
--Enno 13:42, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
request for help [10 apr 2014]
age (87) doesn't make sense. what happened in this family?
thx, R--woepwoep 21:17, 9 April 2014 (UTC)
The death certificate definitely says 87 (first thought was that might have been a transcription error). Bene baptized in 1742 does seem like the most logical one to connect as the wife of Garrit Jan te Wopenreijs. Perhaps the person who declared her death didn't know her proper age? I found another resource for Lichtenvoorde, though you may already be aware of it. Some children of Bartelt te Keveler and Geertruid Gebbink were:
Have you found it to be common that families from this area didn't follow strict Dutch familial naming patterns? --Jennifer (JBS66) 22:28, 9 April 2014 (UTC)
because the name of the spouse is different, perhaps Bartelt remarried ?
i created a second Bartelt, perhaps they are the same person.
thx, Ron--woepwoep 14:09, 10 April 2014 (UTC)
Akke Vries-Bosma [12 April 2014]
Hello Jennifer, thank you so much for the ship manifest about the Bosma family, now it's all very clear to me, i have a ship manifest from Sietze Bosma and 3 daughters, they are sailing from Rotterdam on February the 18 th 1911. But I couldn't find Akke his wife and the other children, so perhaps i thought Akke and some children passed away here in the Netherlands, it could be isn't?
But find nothing at all, so a mystery for me, but now it's all clear, Akke and the rest of the family sailing later that year!
And for all this i was looking and find it, for the brother of Sietze Bosma, his name was Oene Bosma and married with Trijntje Kooistra and that's the family i've been looking for and i have a lot of Kooistra's already, because my mother in law is a Kooistra, i've did already a genealogical research for this family many years ago, but we discover that we had the wrong ancestors to start with, so now we are doing it all over again and perhaps better.
If you interest in my own website about families who are related to me namely Bos Family, i have also many relatives who's living into the States as well Canada and not forget in Australia to.
My web address is: 
With kind regards, Henk.--Butlerbob 15:25, 12 April 2014 (UTC)
Bad and unexpected reactions ... 2 contributors [18 apr 2014]
The pages that were created empty , must be put back again. I think most pages even edited by multiple/other users.
Family: Isaac DuBois and Neeltje Roosa [17 April 2014]
Hello- I have been researching my family genealogy for about 20 years and with all the added online sources now, I am still finding new discoveries everyday.
I found the "Werelate" website today but wanted to help clarify the information on the captioned family.
Neeltje Roosa is one of my great, great, great+++ grandmothers! born in 1689 to Heyman Aldertse Roosa and Anna Margriet Van Rosenvelt.
Dutch Reformed Church records from Kingston, New York show that on September 18, 1709 Johannes Cool and Neeltje Roosa baptized a daughter, Maroa Cool, with witnesses Willem Cool and Engeltje Rosa present.
A later Dutch Reformed Church record shows Banns of marriage on November 14, 1725 were made for Willem Dekker, widower of Rachel Van Auken, and Neeltje Roosa, widow of Johannes Cool.
In the Captioned Werelate family page, it shows our Neeltje Roosa married to Isaac DuBois in 1732. I believe that is a error. The woman who married Isaac DuBois was Neeltjen Roosa born in 1713 to Aldert Roosa and Aegjen Krom. Aldert was a brother of our Neeltje.
I added an edit to the Werelate page to clarify the distinction between Neeltje & Neeltjen.
I hope this is helpful to you.
Regards, Kathy--Ancestors1600 01:53, 15 April 2014 (UTC)
Thank you Jenn and good luck with your continuing work on our ancestral lines!--Ancestors1600 14:53, 17 April 2014 (UTC)
Geesteren, Borculo, Gelderland, Netherlands [16 apr 2014]
i have a question about Geesteren, Gelderland, Netherlands.
my impression was that the situation around 1900 is default for Places, Geesteren was part of Borculo at that time. still when i type Geesteren, Borculo, Gelderland, Netherlands, the page defaults back to Geesteren, Gelderland, Netherlands.
i don't understand the Places policy anymore. can you help me understand ?
thx, Ron--woepwoep 05:19, 16 April 2014 (UTC)
BD in name suffix field [22 April 2014]
Dutch Translation [24 April 2014]
Evening Jennifer, I've added two images here. I've worked dutifully on the translation, but have gone about as far as I can using Google Translate. Hoping you know someone who with time could fine-tune the translations to make them more grammatically correct. They're mostly understandable as is, but could always be better....--Frank 02:47, 25 April 2014 (UTC)
Neder-Elten [28 apr 2014]
how are you today?
i stumbled into another one of those nice little puzzles. see http://www.werelate.org/wiki/Person:Gerarda_de_Reus_%281%29
Neder-Elten church community, is it Elten Germany? is it Didam, Netherlands?
it is not even on Wikipedia (weird) care to join the quest?
thx, Ron--woepwoep 22:20, 27 April 2014 (UTC)
Emma Jean Funk [15 May 2014]
This is my Mother, I have been trying to add different things, and not being familiar with this site has causes me some problems. Sorry to have caused you some problems Now my question is Can I add her death notice from the paper, news, since living people are mentioned there.--Pattylee 14:20, 14 May 2014 (UTC)
Breathing room and trust [23 May 2014]
Jennifer - you have to give us some more breathing room and trust. I am well aware of the first name/last name rule for page titles and was in the process of fixing a handful of old, incorrect pages that appeared to have been abandoned by another user and were mostly red-linked. They have been wrong for years, so you've had plenty of time to correct them, yet all of a sudden you do so at the same time that I am working on them. That is rude and discouraging, especially when it results in lost work on a page that was being simultaneously edited. You know that manual editing is labor intensive and time consuming. If you really feel that you must interject while others are working, a more supportive way would be to write a heads-up alert on a Talk page or better yet, to extend the courtesy of a 12-24 hour grace period before interjecting to allow the dust to settle and to see if your concern still exists.--Cos1776 14:46, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
welcoming new users [27 May 2014]
I would like to help welcome new users to the site. How soon would I be able to begin or what process is needed to begin? Thanks! Menika_65--Menika 65 11:39, 27 May 2014 (UTC)
Seeking advice on Source pages for church records [9 June 2014]
Could you please take a look at the topic Source pages for Norwegian kirkebøker I posted on Kaffilars talk page earlier this month, and then give me some advice. (BTW: I have not yet received a response from Kaffilars.)
I've been doing some more thinking on this topic, and am aware of 3 dilemmas:
My preference is still to have one source page per municipality (for church records), which I get the impression is what you did with the Netherlands source pages (and I think would provide the most flexibility for people to map their GEDCOMs to), but I am interested in your feedback on whether the above dilemmas suggest that we should switch to one source page per set of parish records, as Kaffilars seems inclined to do. Any advice you can provide would be appreciated. Thanks.--DataAnalyst 02:59, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
For the Netherlands, there are the pre-1811 DTB church sources and the post-1811 Burgerlijke Stand civil sources. You are correct that we are creating sources at the municipal level for them. More specific information (like the town/parish, page number, type of record baptism/marriage/burial) etc are placed within the citation itself (here's an example). We are also removing the year ranges from the title because they are very FHL centric and don't reflect the actual years of the NL source. I would agree that both Source:Åseral, Vest-Agder, Norway. Åseral 1793-1815 Parish Records (Official) and Source:Åseral, Vest-Agder, Norway. Åseral 1815-1853 Parish Records (Official) should be combined.
I've found that some of the Dutch users don't like to use the sources when the citation shows the FHL dates, Utah as the location, the film numbers, etc. This may be why Kaffilars created new pages and titled them "Official". When I'm working on the NL sources, I remove the FHL as publisher information, and the film numbers in the large text field - I only keep the FHLC as a repository.
As for which source page to link to when municipalities change... When you are looking at the page on the Norwegian Digital Archive, is it clear which municipality's book you're looking at? I ask because I'm looking at one as an example - Kirkebeker Bjelland 3 1792-1815 - if I found a record in that book for an event in Åseral, I would think that I'd still cite it back to the Bjelland book. I think see also links could help, as could putting the dates the municipality was in which location on the place pages.
There has been some recent talk about how to name sources whose location changed before 1900. Should they match the place page title or should they be titled to reflect the place as it was when the source existed?
If there is a piece to your dilemmas that I've not addressed, or if I can give you other NL examples, just let me know! --Jennifer (JBS66) 15:51, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for the help - that gives me direction for addressing the dilemmas. Making the pages a bit less FHL-centric is also a good idea - I'll work on that. For the benefit of anyone wondering what I plan to do about the third dilemma:
BTW: The reason Kaffilars put (Official) in the title is because the Norwegian Digital Archive includes both "official" church registers as well as register copies, and identifies each set of records accordingly - so he was just copying from how they are presented in the Norwegian Digital Archive. Occasionally, a record will show up in the official records but not the copy, or vice versa. Also, I believe that the page numbers don't coincide, so it makes sense to identify which set you are looking at. I plan to identify when I use a parish register copy in my citation details and assume that others will assume I am referring to the official records otherwise.
Volunteer for GEDCOM review [18 June 2014]
Dallan has put out a message on the Watercooler that you need more volunteers for the GEDCOM review committee. I would like to put myself forward.
As you may know I worked on improving the place pages for Ontario and, following that, the seemably never-ending task of sorting out England and Scotland. I live in England and am aware of online sources provided by organizations on this side of the pond that WR users in North America may be unfamiliar with. Looking at other people's pages (which I often do to break the monotony of an editing places session) I see all sorts of problems that other members have come up against--in the naming of places, the citing of sources, or simply in presenting a person or family page in WR format.
There are a lot more records available online than there were even a few years ago. I have a worldwide Ancestry subscription and have been finding my way around the new FamilySearch.
I am wondering if my experience with these records might be of help in guiding new users whose knowledge of their forebears before the first emigration to North America might be fuzzy or incorrect.
Regards --Goldenoldie 09:18, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
Apologies accepted [4 July 2014]
And my thoughts go out to you about your pet.
Looking forward to being part of the GEDCOM checking team.
Regards --Goldenoldie 16:01, 4 July 2014 (UTC)
Sorry, didn't see your whole message until after closing the edit. Mentoring is a great way to go.
Now I must stop half-listening [to the TV] and start watching my favourited tennis player playing a fellow Canadian--it's Wimbledon here. --Goldenoldie 16:04, 4 July 2014 (UTC)
Boschma Family in the USA, The Neterlands and Australia [6 July 2014]
My Name is Jan Boers from the Netherlands, I'm very interested is the Boschma family genealogy.
The reason is that:
My Mother was Geertruida Cornelia Boschma (1914-1995 ; Her father was Hendrik Anton Frans Boschma (1885-1965); His mother was Yttje Jans Boschma (1861-1919); Her father was Jan Rintjes Boschma (1814-1874 who was married to Emke Gerrits Eringa (1824-1865).
So there is certainly a relationship with the Boschma family I found on Werelate.org , but the list of siblings of Jan Rintjes Boschma and Emke Gerrits Eringa there is incomplete. In total there were 15 siblings!
Please let me know if you are interested in completing the list and perhaps in a number of Boschma generations in Friesland before them.
On geneanet.org I have published my family trees (BOERSJ) , with a number of other related families too, but certainly with many Boschma ancestors (oldest 1580) You will also find their already: the 2 brothers an 1 sister of Yttje that immigrated to Massachusetts, but I'm interested to find out somewhat more about their siblings etc.
After World War 2, also 2 brothers of my mother immigrated with their families to Australia.
I hope to receive a response from you soon!
Regards Jan Boers--JanB1948 14:14, 6 July 2014 (UTC)
Unexpected Connections to Maaike Jacobs Bijlsma [10 July 2014]
I was thinking that Person:Maaike Bijlsma (4) might be connected to some of my Bouma (maternal grandmother) Bijlsmas. What I found was a direct relationship via my maternal grandfather's Postmas and the first husband of one of my father's nth great uncles on his mother's side. Once again proving that one never can tell what connections are to be found until one looks. --pkeegstra 10:04, 8 July 2014 (UTC)
Remove ... but I want just cleanup the "UID" [14 July 2014]
Hello Jennifer ! See please Family:Uriah Hawkins and Lydia Unknown (1) ... I already removed the children for some other examples of this "problem". Is this the better method ? Better as to recreate the pages for the children ? This second "option" is for me not so "good" because I have no source to prove that those children exist. Amicalement - Marc ROUSSEL - --Markus3 16:34, 8 July 2014 (UTC)
Marc, honestly, I don't know the best fix for this problem. I'm going to ask Dallan for more information and the best approach to fix it. --Jennifer (JBS66) 15:55, 11 July 2014 (UTC)
LNU ---> last name unknown ? [22 July 2014]
Hello, Jennifer ! I'am trying to clean up this family : Person:Thomas Newburgh (3) and I read that all mothers are "LNU". Can you confirm it's an abreviation ? please, see and the other abreviation "Gnu" (given name unknown) here ... Amicalement - Marc ROUSSEL - --Markus3 05:32, 22 July 2014 (UTC)
Van Der Leij Family [22 July 2014]
Hello Jennifer. I have been looking at our family pages and have some information that will need researching and corroborating. Jan Annes van der Leij 1746 – 1811 First wife Dieuke Murks. She was the daughter of Murk Rienks and Hiltje Gerrits. She was born on 4 Jan 1793 in Hijum and died on 3 Jan 1781. They had 10 children. Jan Annes remarried shortly after on 22 July 1781. His second wife Lijsbeth Johannes (Leistra)was the daughter of Johannes Haijes and Minke Heins who farmed in Wester Nijkerk and where she was born and christened on 19 Feb 1764. She died in Hallum on 5 March 1842 at the age of 78. There were 11 children but this was hard to trace as very few were christened. Jan Annes was one of 8 children born to Anne Jakobs (Jacobs) (christened 11 Jan in Finkum)and his second wife Foekje Alberts (christened 6 Feb 1718 in Finkum). Foekje was the daughter of Albert Jansen and Aattje Pijbes. The first wife was Lijsbeth Tjipkes of Stiens whom Anne Jacobs married on 18 Feb 1725. They had no children. Anne Jakobs (Jacobs) adopted the surname of Balkeindstra reflected on his marriage certificate and on the christening documents of his children. His occupation is given as "Ontvanger van Florenen". He must have died before 1766 because Foekje remarried on 19 Jan 1766 Rienk Jans Chirurgin op de Leije. They had no children. Anne Jacobs had a sister Wijpck (christened 26 Aug 1714) who married Roelof Claasses, a farmer from Hallum, on 15 May 1740. Their children took the surname Lettinga. Anne Jacobs and Wijpck were the children of Jacob Annes (Finkland)birthplace unknown, married on 28 July 1671 in Finkum to Wijpck Willems (christened 24 Sept 1682 in Finkum). Wijpke died before 1725, maybe in childbirth. This is quite a mouthful and comes from a booklet entitled "Het Geslacht Van Der Leij en enkele mededeelingen, die er mee annex zijn, verzameld door SJ Hoogland, rustend landbouwer te Leeuwarden. No bibliographic details. I hope this helpful in adding and completeing some of the pages. I want to start adding photos as well. Kind regards, Jenny van der Leij--Jvdleij 11:30, 22 July 2014 (UTC)
getting stuck [23 July 2014]
can you help with the following? http://www.werelate.org/wiki/Person:Johanna_Izereef_%284%29
there are two death records, which one is true?
thx, Ron--woepwoep 22:15, 23 July 2014 (UTC)
Kan geen pagina meer laden [4 aug 2014]
Hallo Jennifer Heb een probleem met nieuwe pagina's aan te maken krijg steeds de melding (Sorry! Uw bewerking is niet verwerkt omdat sessiegegevens verloren zijn gegaan. Probeer het opnieuw. Als het dan nog niet lukt, meldt u dan af en weer aan.)
Alles geprobeerd afmelden en computer opstarten niets helpt Gr Herman--herman34 21:48, 2 August 2014 (UTC)
had gisteren hetzelfde (Chrome) opgelost door chrome af te sluiten, cache gegevens te verwijderen (clear history) en opnieuw opstarten R--woepwoep 20:46, 4 August 2014 (UTC)
how to add immigrants to South Africa on Werelate.org [28 August 2014]
Hi Jennifer, where can I find the official South African (Cape Town) birth and death certificates and how can I add names to the category "Dutch immigrants to South Africa? Thanks for helping ---Beatrijs 01:57, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
Thanks very much for your response Jennifer! Regards from Beatrijs--Beatrijs 20:56, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
Hi Jennifer, my question is about passengers from Holland to Grand Rapids and from there to Transvaal, SA. Where can I view these? I have the exact years and names but cannot find them in Ellis Island's website. Where else can I find these data? Thanks again Jennifer!--Beatrijs 21:02, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
Hi Jennifer, yes the names are Aafke Meersma and Kornelis Bakker, who according to the bevolkingsregister Leeuwarden 1876-1904 migrated to Grand Rapids on 2.1.1890 with 7 children. From there she, her husband and a few children migrated to Transvaal on 18.2.1890. I have contact with one of the descendants of Kornelis Bakker who lives in Cape town. She is trying to get more information but you know how it is, most relatives past away:-( I have uploaded a picture of Aafke Meersma with her 7 children, probably taken in Grand Rapids. Hope this helps finding them.. Thanks Jennifer! ---Beatrijs 06:00, 20 August 2014 (UTC)
Hi Jennifer, I come back to my former message to you about the family Cornelis Bakker and Aafke Meersma. They left Holland for the USA and for South Africa. I am trying to find the ships with a list of passengers where this family and their 7 children boarded. Dates are probably 2.1.1890 to Grand Rapids, USA and 18.2.1890 to Transvaal, South Africa. Can you help? Thanks so much Jennifer! Regards ---Beatrijs 00:33, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
Archives du Nord [21 August 2014]
Hello, Jennifer ! ... Person:Brigitte Heger (1) --> I am sorry ! My links (on 2013, December the 27th) were perfectly correct, but with the time, this french administration had changed the indexation. It's a "classical" trouble with the most Archives Départementales in France ! I will find the new links in a couple of hours. Amicalement - Marc ROUSSEL - --Markus3 04:44, 20 August 2014 (UTC)
from USA to SA [1 September 2014]
Hi Jennifer, you did a fantastic job finding Bakker/Meersma family, thank you!!
According to comments made by a family member: Wybe Fennema, who has researched the whole family, a few children of Cornelis Bakker returned to Holland, stayed for a couple of years - some of them - then returned again the USA and from there to South Africa. According to het Bevolkings register in Leeuwarden migrated the whole family on 2.1.1890 to Grand Rapids and according to the passengers list of the vessel "Friesland" they arrived all 9 in the Port of New York on 17.5.1892, (embarked in Antwerp). That seems like a long time:-)
Do we have access to (a) passenger list(s)from New York to the Netherlands? And from New York to SA?
Frederik Bakker for instance came back to Kollum and went back to the USA on 4.5.1892; then returned to Holland on 30.7.1896 to Leeuwarden and moved to Haarlem on 13.5.1901. So far the research from Wybe Fennema. So between 13.5.1901 and 5.11.1948 (death in Rondebosch, SA) he must have migrated to South Africa. The Dutch people love to travel as it seems:-)
Thanks again for your help Jennifer. Many regards from Beatrijs--Beatrijs 05:50, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
More on FHLC references [21 October 2014]
Jennifer I would appreciate your consideration of this little problem:
I have been trying to tie up Illogan, Cornwall, England and some of the less important places around about it, such as Tuckingmill. Tuckingmill was an ecclesiastical parish carved out of Illogan and Camborne (another neighbouring bigger place) in 1846.
Having sorted out Tuckingmill (which was completely new to me), I thought I would just check through Illogan's "What links here" list to see if there might be any other smaller places which I ought to work with at the same time. I came across Source:Church of England. Parish Church of Tugby. Parish Chest Materials, 1846-1861. Wikipedia and A Vision of Britain through Time both stated that Tugby was in Leicestershire. I checked Google Earth--no reference except to football clubs (rugby). I then clicked through to the source itself and the Family History Catalog reference on the source page. Guess what? Back in 2008 the WeRelate agent appears to have confused Tuckingmill and Tugby--possibly two places following each other in an alphabetical list.
Before I dive in and correct our source page, is there somewhere this hypothesis could be checked?
--Goldenoldie 08:36, 3 October 2014 (UTC)
Wikje Klazes Stienstra/Wikje van der Woude [20 October 2014]
Any idea what the backstory is for this woman, my 2g grandmother's namesake first cousin? The huwelijksbijlagen says she is onecte dochter van Antje van der Woude, but her death register names her father and gives her last name as Stienstra.
I don't know what to use as a topic....I see you connected to my family [22 October 2014]
I just found this site yesterday.....and i typed in my famy name....and you and a man show up as connected to me? I don't know, just trying to figure out how this all works.....my grandmother's last name is not spelled correctly.--PamHoleton 19:32, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
GEDCOM Export Ready [9 December 2014]
The GEDCOM for tree Smereczynski is ready to download..
Gedcom Siemonsma [17 December 2014]
Jennifer, When will my file be released?--BenS 09:36, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
Edited out my lineage [30 December 2014]
This it my Bassett line. For some reason, you deleted Samuel Bassett and Martha Pease.
Nathan Bassett b1667 Mary Huckins b1673 Samuel Bassett b 1693 Martha Pease b 1696 Cornelius b 1722 Lydia Norton b 1726 Ebenezer b 1752 Abigail Adams b 1760 Cornelius Bassett b 1798 Elizabeth Cushing.--Riti 17:12, 30 December 2014 (UTC)
Hello Riti, I edited the page for Cornelius Bassett. This is what the page looked like prior to my edit. You'll see that two sets of parents appear for Cornelius, Samuel Bassett and Martha Pease and Ebenezer Bassett and Abigail Adams.
Cornelius' page mentions that he was born 1789 and married 1817. Therefore, Samuel and Martha Pease cannot be his parents since they died in 1770 and 1774 respectively. That is why I removed them as Cornelius' parents with a summary edit of "removed impossible parents". I did not delete the page for Samuel and Martha, their pages still appear here: Family:Samuel Bassett and Martha Pease (1). --Jennifer (JBS66) 18:26, 30 December 2014 (UTC)
Doede Hendriks Laskewitz [26 jan 2015]
Hi Jennifer, I believe his wife's name is Jenny Copeland, probably born in the USA. I refer to the son of that couple: Ed T. Laskewitz, born in Marion, Iowa. Found in "Vital Records". See my website with My Heritage Hettema/Fennema families. Searching for Jenny (or similar) Copeland in the USA, based on her birth year 1829 and census 1870 (Marion) might be the clue? Kind regards from Anke--Beatrijs 22:12, 6 January 2015 (UTC)
Looks like the spelling reads "Jeannet" or "Jeannette". If she died at age 74 in 1906 then birth year should be 1831 or 1832?
Best regards, Ron woepwoep 07:39, 26 January 2015 (UTC)
New categories needed [23 January 2015]
correct french departement name [25 January 2015]
Hello, Jennifer ! Please, we must rename "Place:Côtes-du-Nord, France" to "Place:Côtes-d'Armor, France". (Only an administrator can do it). The name "Côtes-d'Armor" is official since 1990. See here ! We had in France always confusion with "Nord", which is an other departement, not in Bretagne. Thank you ! Amicalement - Marc ROUSSEL - --Markus3 04:26, 25 January 2015 (UTC)
Van der Leij pages [29 January 2015]
Hello Jennifer. I have been fortunate to have found a friend in Stiens who has been researching van der Leij and the Iest family as she has recently restored an historic home in Stiens. She has sent bits of information to me and will update pages when necessary. Amongst the items are maps of farms that belonged to the van der Leijs and photos of a house in Leeuwarden. I also have this is information that predates the family van der Leij information. It is contained in a small publication entitled "Het Geslacht Van Der Leij ... "verameld door S.J.Hoogland rustend landbouwer te Leeuwarden. I don't know how accurate it is but I have mentioned it to you before. I hope this can add to the pages. I have translated it condensed it to the following: << THE VAN DER LEIJ FAMILY
The oldest known forefather of the many branches of the Van der Leij family (most of the descendents of whom established themselves in north-western Fiesland) can be regarded as:
His occupation is given as “Gemeente-Ontvanger” in Finkum. The surname Van der Leij did not exist and was probably first used by a grandson of Jacob Annes. Jacob’s marriage is recorded in the marriage register of Finkum but there is no record of his christening in the records of Finkum, Hallum or Stiens. He was more than likely born elsewhere.
Jacob Annes married Wijpck Willems of Finkum on 5 January 1710. They were married in the church in Finkum by Ds Prikke of St Anna Parochie who was the minister there from 1707 – 1719. Wijpck was christened in Finkum on 24 September 1682, and was the daughter of Willem Thijssen and Riemke Gerbens who were married in Finkum on 28 July 1671.
Two children were born to Jacob and Wijpck: Anne, christened in Finkum on 11 January 1711, and Wijpck, christened on 26 August 1714. Wijpck was named after her mother who died before 1725 probably during childbirth because on 18 February 1725, Jacob Annes was remarried to Lijsbeth Tjipkes of Stiens; they were childless.
Anne Jacobs married Foekje Alberts on 3 August 1738 in Hijum. Foekje was christened in Finkum on 6 February 1718, and was a daughter of Albert Jans and Aattje Pijbes, both from Finkum where they were married on 16 January 1709.
Anne Jacobs appears to have adopted the surname (suffix from) Balkeindstra because his name appears as Anne Jacobs Balkeindstra on the records of his marriage and the christening of his children. One can probably draw the conclusion that he lived on “Balkeind”, east of Oude Leije. His occupation is given as “Ontvanger de Florenen” on his marriage record. It is not know when he died but it must have been before 1766 because his widow, Foekje Alberts married Rienk Jans, Chirurgijn in the? Leije, on 19 January 1766 in the church in Hijum. They had no children.
Anne Jacobs and Foekje Alberts had 8 children: Trijntje, Aattje, Jacob, Albert, Jan, Lieuwe, Albert and Dirk. Of the eight I could only trace two marriages, namely the oldest, Trijntje who married Claas Haantjes from Hijum on 9 February 1714, and Jan Annes, the fifth child.
Before I talk about Jan Annes, let me first tell about Anne’s sister, Wijpck, christened on 16 August 1714 in Finkum. She married Roelof Claasses a farmer from Hallum, on 15 May 1740 in Hallum. The children of this marriage all took on the surname “Lettinga”....
JAN ANNES (VAN DER LEIJ)
Son of Anne Jacobs and Foekje Alberts, he was christened on 25 December 1746 and was the first to use the surname Van der Leij. He was a Chirurgijn, or as he later also called himself, “genees- en vroedmeester”. It is possible that he also farmed or managed a farm because in the death register his occupation is given as “Boer”. He died on 6 June 1811 at the age of 64 years.
The farm on which he possibly died, was in Vrouwen Parochie, west of Oude Leije. The barn is no longer there, but the house might still be.
Jan Annes van der Leij married Dieuwke Murks of Finkum on 16 March 1766 in Hijum. She was the daughter of Murk Rienks and Hiltje Gerrits who in turn were married on 1 January 1739 in Hijum. Dieuwke died in Hijum on 3 January 1781. She could have had 10 children if all had lived.
Jan Annes remarried soon after on 22 July 1781 to Lijsbeth Johannes (Leistra) who was born in West Nijkerk where she was also christened on 19 February 1764. She was a daughter of Johannes Haijes and Minke Heins, who farmed in West Nijkerk. Lijsbeth died in Hallum on 5 March 1842 at the age of 78. In her obituary it stated that she was “Gruttersche” in Hallum. >>
Kind regards, Jenny van der Leij.--Jvdleij 14:24, 29 January 2015 (UTC)
[28 February 2015]
Column religions on Landverhuizers [28 February 2015]
what do you think of these abbreviations for religions? Religions-
My first WR GEDCOM upload experience [16 March 2015]
Hi Jennifer. Hard to believe, but I did my first WR GEDCOM upload late last night (Project Warner). I have been working on this project for a friend and decided that I would use the opportunity to build the tree in ancestry and try out the upload process. Since it wasn't a huge tree, I thought it would be a good one to use. It might have been my sometimes slow computer, but I did have to spend quite a long time matching places and sources. I had tried to be careful while I was building the tree at ancestry to change all of the place names to be more in line with those at WR, but many still slipped by.
Anyhow, when I got to the end of the process, the message said that there would be a good likelihood that this GEDCOM would be rejected because there were too many warnings. I looked over the one-page list (3.8%), and there were certainly some that will need follow-up (I printed it out), but some are not incorrect and some are really one issue that is creating multiple warnings (i.e. a census record generates a marriage date fact that is too early, so multiple warnings arise - father is too young, mother is too young, children were born before the marriage, etc.). I would like to ask for this import to be approved to allow me to fix the warning issues at this stage, instead of having to re-import the GEDCOM and go through the place and source matching again. Since the list is only one page long, I think I can address the mostly minor issues fairly quickly. In the future, if I do this again, I will be sure to back out of the import first to fix the warnings and re-import, before I spend a lot of time matching places and sources. Thanks, --Cos1776 12:08, 16 March 2015 (UTC)
Friesland Wisconsin USA [17 March 2015]
Hi, My name is Steve Syens. My Mothers Maiden name was Sytsma and My Mothers, Mothers maiden name was Cupery. Her Mothers name was Annie Cupery born in USA and Annie's Fathers name was Sikke Cupery and his wife was Itske Cupery. All these people lived in FRiesland Wisconsin USA. Sikke and Itske were born in Friesland Netherlands. All of these people are Deceased at this time. I grew up in Friesland Wisconsin and spent 50 years living there. I no longer live there but very close and have many friends there. I don't know if this interests you or not. I see you have the name Halbersma on your site. My mother was also related somehow to the Halbersma family. I don't know the connection though.
Steve Syens Beaver Dam Wisconsin USA--syendia388 20:43, 16 March 2015 (UTC)
Syens, Systma, Cupery, Kooistra, Haima [17 March 2015]
Hi Jeniffer, Yes, Taeke Sytsma and Annie Cupery were my Grandparents. Annie who was my Mother's Mom died at the age Of 27 years from tuberculosis. My Mother was only three months old when her Mother died. My Mom always tested positive for TB when tested because her Mother had it when she was pregnant with my Mom. I am 55 now and they have all long passed. I do remember Taeke, (Ted). He lived in Grand Rapids Michigan and would visit us in Wisconsin now and then. I was a young boy when he died. Annie's parents names were Sikke Cupery and Itske Haima both from the Netherlands. Most of these people came from the Friesland area. Hence the name Friesland, Wisconsin. Thank you for you reply. It was very nice to hear from you. If I ever need any assistance I will contact you.
God Bless, Steve Syens--syendia388 23:13, 17 March 2015 (UTC)