User talk:Delijim

Topics


Welcome [23 November 2013]

Welcome to WeRelate, your virtual genealogical community. We're glad you have joined us. At WeRelate you can easily create ancestor web pages, connect with cousins and other genealogists, and find new information. To get started:

  1. Take the WeRelate tour to see what you can do.
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  3. Read the etiquette page to learn expected behavior in a wiki.

If you need any help, I will be glad to answer your questions. Just click on my signature link below and then click on the “Leave a message” link under my name in the upper left corner of my profile page. Thanks for participating and see you around!--Jstump 18:09, 9 February 2009 (EST)



Sources for Elizabeth Presley [9 April 2020]

Hey, jim---

I had the source for Elizabeth's dates listed as "undocumented family sources" because that's all I've ever seen -- people's copies of notes that were copies of earlier notes, that were etc. (There probably was a family Bible back there someplace, but it's apparently long lost.) You replaced that with a link to Find-a-Grave -- and the dates on that stone (which I've never had the opportunity to see) match what I had, so that's okay. However, Elizabeth's birthplace as reported at FaG is as much guesswork as what I already had. And the list of her kids and their dates is still "undocumented family sources." --MikeTalk 00:07, 10 April 2020 (UTC)


John Black married to Milly Norton, who is his father if not Reverend Samuel Black [19 April 2020]

Hello,

I have read on this sight and also from other serious researchers that John Black b 1750 died 1830 married to Milly Norton is NOT the son of The Reverend Samuel Black married to Catherine Shaw. I agree. The question I ask is, The brother of The Reverend Samuel Black; David Black b 1726 Ireland died 1769 Virginia married to Elizabeth (McClenanchen?) had a son John Black, born about 1755. This per contested Will document and Probate Record of Augusta County VA 21 Mar 1770 WB4-292.

Is it possible this is the John Black married to Milly Norton? This John Black has a born 4 Oct 1750 but I've not seen any document verifying it for certain.

Mike Black--Mikeblack64 03:26, 19 April 2020 (UTC)


Bethsheba Gaddy, Archibald Moore, & Sarah Moore by ElleBell14 [30 May 2020]

Hi,

I added this a long time ago, when I requested a new password, they sent it to Jacie9. Now I can't delete these two people. Please remove them for me. I do not believe that William Gaddy and Sarah Bryant had a daughter named Bethsheba Gaddy.--Jacie9 00:51, 30 May 2020 (UTC)


administrative delete [11 January 2021]

I would like to ask you not to use your administrative delete to avoid going through Speedy Delete or a merge. This is separate from when you are cleaning up pages that might violate rules but pages being deleted for genealogical reasons.

You deleted a page I had contributed to and I got no warning and now cannot look at what I contributed. If you had merged it, for example, I could have still looked at the history to see it, or if you used Speedy Delete, I would have had time to review it before it was deleted.

Thank you. --Jrich 22:34, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

Ok, no problem, Happy New Year,

Jim:)


James Daugherty [24 February 2021]

Hey there!

I just saw your message from 2017 regarding the removal of James Daugherty as a son of Charles Daugherty! Oops. I never saw it there.

The Daugherty genealogy is a nightmare. Most of it has been propagated by the old O'Dochartaigh Family Association run by the late Pat "Inch" Dougherty. Correspondence with a frustrated genealogist who used to work with him revealed he "gave people what they wanted to hear" -- meaning he fabricated genealogies that took their ancestry back to the 15th century or before. The association also published the disastrous genealogy of all the colonial Virginia Daughertys making them one big happy family that has been copied-and-pasted ad nauseum. The society took enough factual evidence and added a few twists of make-believe and created an amalgamation of several Virginia men named Michael Daugherty and created the fictitious Michael Mor O'Dochartaigh.

I disconnected James Daugherty (my ancestor) and Anthony Daugherty (James's brother) because they are sons of a John Daugherty. Another son is Thomas, who is often thrown into the Micheal Mor lineage as well. These three men are conclusively proven as brothers via advanced Y-DNA testing as well as through Chancery Court records regarding land their father John Daugherty possessed in then Augusta County, Virginia.

Many of the Daugherty lines that connect to this fictitious "Michael Mor" have been shown to be separate Daugherty lines via Y-DNA testing.

Charles Daugherty really only has one confirmed child -- a daughter Catherine who married David Herbison in Botetourt County, Virginia, in 1773, in which Rabekah Dougherty witnessed. A James Daugherty also witnessed this marriage, but this is not the same James Daugherty who died in Wythe County in 1799. That James is my ancestor as previously mentioned. It seems likely that George Daugherty is a son of Charles based on land dealings within the same area. The James who witnessed the Herbison-Daugherty marriage could be her brother as well, but which James is he? It has been speculated that this is the James who died c1812 in Mercer County, KY, but I have not pursued it to confirm.

Cornelius is another mess, as it appears that there is more than one man with this name, and researchers also struggle with this and give a singular Cornelius a great number of wives and children, ignoring records that obviously contradict each other. Descendants of the Cornelius that went to Overton County, Tennessee, also appear to have a unique Y-DNA signature that sets them apart from other lineages. There is no documentary evidence that Charles had ANY son named Cornelius, although it has been surmised that he is the man who married Mary Hill. Descendants of this couple also have a unique Y-DNA signature that matches no other Daugherty families.

Furthermore, the Michael Daugherty mentioned in a 1754 Augusta County, Virginia, record as being involved in a suit when he was a resident of "the township of New Londonderry, Chester County, Pennsylvania" was apparently taxed as a single, unmarried man in Pennsylvania at the time he left for Virginia -- thus not the father of the proverbial three sons (although I see on WeRelate he gets four).

The entire Daugherty lineage needs to be scrapped and put back together using primary records. The families on here are put together using the same "Michael Mor" garbage and then other Daughertys are forced into it. Most of these families are distinct and separate lineages, and it is my belief that the William, Charles, and Michael families are all separate. Charles Brunk Heinemann wrote a book on the Daugherty families of the Southern States in 1935, and he felt the same, although he was admittedly stymied over the many Michaels, Corneliuses, Jameses, etc. as we are today.

I CAN say with certainty that James, Thomas, and Anthony were brothers, via Y-DNA testing and documentation, and they do not belong within this network of Daugherty men. They are certainly not children of Charles.

My goal was to spend more time in Virginia and write up an article on these families, but then came the pandemic and some health issues of my own. I would like to put more of my Daugherty cluster on here, but I need to gather all my sources, as I would want to do it correctly and not half-ass.

Bottom line: the Daughertys of colonial Virginia need to be researched using primary record sources with the help of Y-DNA testing. The Daugherty Y-DNA project is a robust one, and I am in daily contact with one of the administrators, Zack Daugherty.

When the world resumes a bit of normalcy, I hope to do more work on these families.

Mike

Michael D. Lacopo D.V.M. 10525 Red Pine Drive Granger, IN 46530-7529 574-271-0757 Business www.Roots4U.com Roots4U.blogspot.com--INPowerMac 03:24, 24 February 2021 (UTC)


Fraziers of Augusta County, VA [28 April 2021]

The Chancery Court records for Augusta County are digitized and available through the Virginia Memory Project at the Library of Virginia.

I've been blogging about the details within those records. There are some stunning revelations!

My blog posts are here: dannmnortongenealogy.wordpress.com.

Dann Norton--Dann 15:32, 28 April 2021 (UTC)


Thanks Dann, I'll check it out:)


William Patterson (60) [4 May 2021]

Hi Jim, You write about the book: Descendents [sic] of William Patterson: Who settled on South River in Augusta County, Virginia, about 1740 I have search everywhere for this book and cannot find it. 2 libraries have it but I cannot sign it out and have tried through my local libraries. Can you help me with this? William Patterson of South River is my direct line. I would love to read this book if at all possible. My direct email is noravance1@gmail.com . Thanks, Nora Patterson-Vance--PattersonOfKnoxCountyKentucky 01:41, 4 May 2021 (UTC)


Robert Rogers 1678 Northern Ireland - 1753 Hanover Twp. Lancaster Co PA [25 May 2021]

This is my family. I've been researching since 1970's. I'd be happy to provide deeper information and supply supporting documentation. the general information looks good however our dates differ somewhat.

His sons: Robert Jr died in 1745, Seth married Katharine also referred to as "Catren" (most likely a Cooper). He died in 1758. And Hugh my 4th gg-grand father died in 1758 intestate. All died in Hanover Twp in Lancaster Co PA

His younger son Geroge traveled with others to Augusta Co VA. That trip included his oldest sister Mary Sarah Rogers 1695-1754 that married Col John J Patton 1689-1757. They married in Northern Ireland.

His oldest son Joseph abt 1695 Northern Ireland - bef 1750 Anson Co NC took his family from PA to Anson NC. Shortly Hugh also took his sons to Anson. obtained a NC land grant to get them established. Hugh was in Anson in 1753 to obtain the grant and again in 1755 to sell it. However he maintained his home in PA. In 1754 he signed a Pastor's call letter in Lancaster PA.

Please advise how I can contribute with details.

Mike Rogers gedeckt@roadrunner.com--Ke4isw 00:54, 25 May 2021 (UTC)


Fraziers of Augusta County, VA [6 June 2021]

Dear Delijim,

The Chancery Court Records of Augusta County, VA, reveal that there are many mistakes in the Frazier genealogy! I have written several blogs about these records and what they reveal. The big surprise: Samuel Craig Frazier died in 1813 in Augusta Co, VA, leaving one illegitimate son, Benjamin Franklin Frazer, who died in Tippecanoe Co, IN. The Samuel in Mason Co, WV, is NOT the son of Samuel Frazier and Isabella Helena Craig. And the maybe even BIGGER surprise--Isabella Helena is NOT a Craig. According to chancery court complaints, her brother was James FRAIZER, son of Samuel Frazier of Christian's Creek.

I swear, I am not making any of this up. It comes directly from these primary source documents made by our ancestors about themselves!

My articles can be found at dannmnortongenealogy.wordpress.com.

I hope to hear from you soon.

Dann Norton--Dann 03:02, 28 May 2021 (UTC)


Hi Dan, I'll check out your info when we return from a couple of upcoming vacations. One comment I have is regarding your info on Isabella Helena Craig. She is listed on the baptism list of Rev. John Craig as being baptized on 16 June 1745 "in congregation" [Tinkling Spring Church], so I'd say your info on her looks flawed based upon this. Also, keep in mind the term "brother" may be actually "brother-in-law"....

Best regards,

Jim


Help with Source page [22 June 2021]

Hi Delijim - could you help correct/complete Source:Fisher, William Righter. Colonial & Revolutionary Families?

I can't figure out to which book you are referring or if it should be merged with

It only links to one person, so perhaps it was created in error (?)

Thank you, --cos1776 14:00, 21 June 2021 (UTC)


Hi Cos, I corrected it, the author should have been John W. Jordan. Can you merge the two sources? I can't seem to merge them.

Thanks much:)

Jim

No problem. It should be fixed now. It was just a case of the redirect title not matching the target source title exactly. Best Wishes, --cos1776 01:05, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Wasky's [23 August 2021]

Hello, Do you know anything about the Wasky's.

When my 3rd great grandfather George E. Brown was married in 1847 Madison and William Wasky were witnesses for his marriage certificate since his father was deceased.--Gmantellg 02:33, 23 August 2021 (UTC)


Do you know who created the page for Madison Wasky on werelate? I am trying to reach them but this doesn't tell who created this page or how to reach them:


So far as I know the Waskeys are not my relatives. They were witnesses to my Brown ancestors marriage. They could be relatives I don't know about. I assumed the connection was that both of our families owned Mills in Botetourt near each other, but maybe they were related.

The 1847 marriage certificate for George Brown and Elizabeth Bryan lists Madison Waskey and William Waskey as witnesses in Botetourt. However, the werelate page for Madison doesn't mention a William Waskey.--Gmantellg 18:54, 23 August 2021 (UTC)


Thank you. I would upload a copy of the marriage certificate, in case it would help other users, but I don't know if that is possible.

But the 1847 marriage record is witnessed and signed by William Waskey and Madison Waskey.--Gmantellg 23:44, 23 August 2021 (UTC)


https://www.werelate.org/wiki/Person:Michael_Tygart_(1) [1 September 2021]

I am not sure how this works but have been reviewing various sources regarding Michael Tygart alias Michael Teggart of Washington County, PA. I say alias as I have been trying to determine if these names refer to the same person. If so then Michael Tygart alias Teggart would be related to the Clark family that settled in several southwestern counties, i.e. Washington, Westmoreland, and Fayette counties in Pennsylvania.

On the above cited URL page,there is a Reference as follows:

Ohio Valley Historical Association. Annual Report of the Ohio Valley Historical Association
Vol. 5, pg. 25.
Early Settlers on Monongahela

In searching Google Books, I found a book with early reports from the various annual reports of the Ohio Valley Historical Association. There is a book that contains the report of the Fifth Annual meeting held in Pittsburgh in 1911 but I am not able to find the article that would contain material about Michael Tygart. Not sure if Volume 5 refers to the Fifth Annual meeting or not.

Can you help me to find this article? Thanks.

Roger N. Whiting Fort Collins, Colorado--Rogerwhiting 21:37, 28 August 2021 (UTC=----


Hi Roger, I'm not sure where to find the book, it's been a while since I worked on that family.

Best regards,

Jim:)

--- It may be the volume was cited wrong, see this page which I think is what was referred to? --Jrich 21:02, 1 September 2021 (UTC)


Yep, I think you are correct Jrich, good catch:) Thanks,

Jim


Robert Finleys 1726 and 1745 [8 October 2021]

Are you descended from these Roberts? I am probably descended from the elder. There is confused data out there due to claims of two copies of a will and two John Finleys giving several of same names to offspring. I have referred to genealogies by Carmen Finley and Herald Stout, which are not in full agreement, am looking at their conclusions, and think it all needs further study still where data can mean more than one thing.--Finblake 21:42, 8 October 2021 (UTC)

(see previous message)


Pages created by Quolla6 [1 February 2022]

Hi

I'm sure you saw the note I left on Quolla's page about the few hundred isolated pages without dates. Since some of these pages are duplicates with pages you've created, I wondered if you wanted to look through them before I delete them, to see if there are any useful notes you'd like to transfer to other pages (such as the notes I recently merged). Let me know if you need more than a month to do this. Otherwise, in the absence of any response from Quolla6, I will just delete the pages. Thanks--DataAnalyst 19:14, 31 December 2021 (UTC)


Hi DA, I haven't seen the pages from Quolla, is there an easy way for me to review them? Doesn't look like Bill has been active here since this past July, but I think I'd like to likely merge them with my pages if there is an easy way to get that done.

Thanks much and Happy New Year to you and your family!

Jim

The list is on Quolla's talk page at topic #31 Pages without dates. I've already reviewed and deleted some of the pages where there was little to nothing to preserve. For the first page, Abigail Scudder, I converted the notes on the page into a small tree, so it is no longer at risk of being deleted. Any page where I created a fact/event with a date from the notes on the page will be kept - but might also be a duplicate. I think I checked for most pages I updated, but I might have missed something.
I can't see an easy way to do this other than slogging through all the pages, checking for duplicates, and manually merging where you find them. Then cleaning up to get rid of the empty tables in the narrative if you decide to merge the narrative section. I've done a few and it is fairly time consuming. You would be in a better position to evaluate the usefulness of the notes than I.
If you decide a page has no useful info and is not a duplicate (or is just too much effort to merge), feel free to delete the page (or add the speedy delete template if you want a second opinion - I'm currently managing that task).
Good luck. If you need several months to complete this task, just let me know. I am working on a multi-year project and won't be finished very soon.
Happy New Year to you and yours! - Janet --DataAnalyst 22:22, 31 December 2021 (UTC)

Thanks Janet, give me a few weeks and I'll work through them.

Take care and Happy New Year!

Jim:)

Hi. Just checking in to see how this is going. Are you still working through these pages, and if so, do you have any idea how much longer it will take? I don't want to rush you - just want to make sure I know when I can delete the remaining pages. Thanks--DataAnalyst 17:42, 28 January 2022 (UTC)

Yes, still working through them. I also actually talked to Bill on the phone a week or so ago and he also said he would help with them too... Will work them when I can, been busy with family issues, etc. Thanks.

Thanks for letting me know.--DataAnalyst 20:27, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

Anjer Price [5 May 2022]

 I am descended from John Price Sr. of Shenandoah County, Virginia.  YDNA results at familytree dna shows that Price male descendants of Anjer and my John Price share a common ancestor.  I believe that ancestor to be a grandfather.

Since you have been involved in genealogy for some time, perhaps you have noticed the amount of misinformation in online family trees. What I can tell you is that Anger Price and Richard Price resided in Shenandoah County circa 1777 to 1783 near their Price cousins (my line). Both were married on the same day in 1783 in Shenandoah County. Richard's wife Lucy according to the marriage record is Lucy Price. The Revolutionary War pension application of Anjer Price contains a statement from Lucy identifying Anjer as her brother. Therefore, Richard could not be Anger's brother or he would be marrying his sister. I have more information to share if you are interested.--Stone.dm 23:22, 5 May 2022 (UTC)


Anjer Price [5 May 2022]

 I am descended from John Price Sr. of Shenandoah County, Virginia.  YDNA results at familytree dna shows that Price male descendants of Anjer and my John Price share a common ancestor.  I believe that ancestor to be a grandfather.

Since you have been involved in genealogy for some time, perhaps you have noticed the amount of misinformation in online family trees. What I can tell you is that Anger Price and Richard Price resided in Shenandoah County circa 1777 to 1783 near their Price cousins (my line). Both were married on the same day in 1783 in Shenandoah County. Richard's wife Lucy according to the marriage record is Lucy Price. The Revolutionary War pension application of Anjer Price contains a statement from Lucy identifying Anjer as her brother. Therefore, Richard could not be Anger's brother or he would be marrying his sister. I have more information to share if you are interested.--Stone.dm 23:26, 5 May 2022 (UTC)


John Price d.1819 son of Joseph Price [6 June 2022]

I note you have added some records to John W. Price. Thank you for this.

Just wanted to make you aware that there is additional information in the chancery records of Cumberland County VA. Google search Virginia Memory: Chancery Records or https://www.lva.virginia.gov/chancery/ Select Cumberland County and enter Price in the Surname box. One of particular interest may be the following: Locality Index Number CUMBERLAND CO 1822-012 Plaintiff(s) Defendant(s) James Price ADMR OF John Price SR ETC

Surname(s) Combs Gunter Lewis Price Reynolds--Stone.dm 23:29, 5 June 2022 (UTC)


Thanks much, feel free to add any more records you wish to help other researchers of this family.

Best regards,

Jim:)


featured page [16 July 2022]

Hi

A new user brought a minor issue to my attention on the Featured Page section of the Home page:

I think there is a little problem in the third sentence which looks like an incomplete edit.

--DataAnalyst 20:14, 16 July 2022 (UTC)


Ok, I re-worded it, so it flows a bit better.

Thanks much and have a great weekend,

Jim:)


Alexander Hite [4 August 2022]

Fixed many errors of Alexander Hite,

Alexander Hite was naturalized with his father 1769, his father was Jacob Hite (woolcomber), and both were born outside the British Crown. This makes him not the son of Jacob Hite (son of Jost Hite) who was born in PA.

DNA tests prove that Alexander Hite is not related to the line of Jost Hite. The Hite Family Association has published articles on this line and is on their website. Alexander Hite's father is listed in articles as the "Other Jacob Hite".


From Strasburg Lutheran German records, 1768-1829, Strasburg, Virginia, written by George M. Smith and Klaus Wust, Edinburg, Virginia : Shenandoah History Publishers, 1997, page 28 we know that the four children Maria, Frederick, Susannah, and Jacob were baptized and the mother's name was Elizabeth.

Shenandoah County, VA Deed Book C page 7, Alexander Hite and Elizabeth Hite witness a deed, 3 Feb 1777.

Simon Harr, a minister and schoolteacher, married Alexander Hite and Catherine Hiegburger 12 Mar 1781, in Strasburg, Shenandoah, VA; this proves that Catherine Nieburger was not the mother of the first four children.


Additional Abraham Hite was removed as a child of Alexander. He is not listed in the Baptism Records or the will of Alexander--Ltccoleman 20:25, 3 August 2022 (UTC)


thanks for the corrections.

Best regards,

Jim:)


Source inquiry [31 August 2022]

Hello. I'm looking at Source:Schneider, Jim. Burnet - Ferguson - Schneider and wondering if you have further information about this source, some information that might support finding it? My interest comes from Person:David Ferguson (9) being my great-grandfather via Person:Nora Ferguson (2), my paternal grandmother. Thanks. --ceyockey 02:17, 1 September 2022 (UTC)

World Cat entry
preview mode at books.google.com. IN the parts visible didn't seem to be any mention of David Ferguson but may have missed something or prevented from seeing it. --Jrich 03:57, 1 September 2022 (UTC)


Kilgore Family [4 September 2022]

I'm researching the Charles Kilgore family and found a death certificate linking Elizabeth Kilgore (b. 1778) to Robert Whitley (b.1764) of Indiana. Vicki Miller research proves that Elizabeth Black Kilgore was not related to Charles. If you are doing research on the Kilgore family, I would like to share some information with you and discuss further. If not, can you send me a contact name and address that I could do a follow up with and provide my information I've found.

Thanks, David Burns

dave2mary2@gmail.com--Hauteanman 22:15, 4 September 2022 (UTC)


John Pritt born abt 1776 Augusta Virginia [21 October 2022]

Hi

I found the information about John Pritt being born in Augusta Virginia on We Relate and I was told it came from your talk page. I am curious to what document you are using to assert John Pritt being born in Augusta Virginia. I have found the marriage document from 1802 showing he married Margaret in Bath County but have yet to find any first source document for his birth.

I also found a record of him in the 1800 Census in Washington Township, Lycoming County, Pennsylvania, which I am pretty certain its is him as it lines up with the 1820 and 1830 Census records. I have not found any records of him in any 1810 census records however.

Around 1800 there was an influx of Irish Immigrants after the failed 1798 Irish Rebellion which was led by the United Irishman, which were mostly founded by Presbyterian Irish. I am looking at that angle for John Pritt as my family has always been Presbyterian, and I know they are from Ireland and am wondering if he was not really born here but in Ireland and came here after the failed rebellion like so many other Irish. If however you have first source documents for his birth I will need to reevaluate.

Thank You

Darren Pritt--Dwpritt 19:07, 19 October 2022 (UTC)



Hi

So Based on the Deed Records, which by the way how can access those?, It appears that maybe John Pritt, married to Margaret, Was the son of Edward Pritt, who has no wife before, and appeared by himself in the 1820 Census, and John has moved along to Randolph County as he is there in the 1820 census is an is consistent with the text of book called History of Randolph County DR.D. A Bosworth, page 369.

I need to get a look at the 1800 Census, right now I can only search each census by name, so I am the will of of how good the search is recognizing names, which obviously is not good as it did not pick up John Pritt in the 1810 Census in Bath. Do you know how I can look through those records by just going through the census by county and looking for the names myself. In the past I had just gone down to the archives in Seattle, but now they don't people in who are just looking through microfilm, only people who are accessing original documents are allowed in the archives.

I would like to see what other Pritts I can find in the 1810 or 1800 Census records

Thanks Jim

Darren--Dwpritt 03:12, 21 October 2022 (UTC)


William Givens son of John Givens (John Givens 10) and Mary Margaret Sittlington [18 January 2023]

I do appreciate all the work you have done in working on this Givens line. It is a mess in that everyone names their children with the same set of names. I have long felt that the William Givens that moves to Union Co., KY is really the son of this John. I would wish that there was just some more hard evidence one way or the other to prove which is really the son of John. In my case even DNA doesn't really help as I share autosomal DNA with descendants of both Williams! So DNA can't even sort this out. I have a recent Y-DNA match that comes through (we believe John 10) but the research isn't conclusive as to which William is the ancestor. In any case I want to thank you for all you have done and I am willing to do whatever I can to help you. Robert Givens (I go through Samuel Givens the son of John 10)--regivens 23:48, 24 November 2022 (UTC)


This is what I have written up on the William that I believe is the son of John Givens (10) William Givens (18 May I762 Augusta Co.,VA-2 Feb 184? Union, Co.KY) was the son of John and Margaret Givens. He m 9 Mar I789 Rebecca Kenney (l? Sep 1771- 1820 Hopkins Co., KY), dau of Matthew Kenney. During the Revolutionary War William enlisted in I78I as Pvt. in the Company of his half-brother, Capt. John Givens, under Gen. Green. He hauled provisions to the troops at Yorktown. He moved to Fayette Co., KY in I789, then to Bourbon Co. and. in I8IO to Hopkins Co., KY. He moved to Union Co., KY about 1815. William Givens' brother, Thomas, came to Hopkins County from Virginia after having visited another brother, Samuel, in Bourbon Co., KY. His group of friends and family arrived at William's home the night of the earthquake that formed Reelfoot Lake, I6 Dec 1811. The tremors that followed for several weeks so frightened some of the people that they returned to Virginia.

Found in: Some Webster County, Kentucky families - Baker, Bassett,Givens, Johnson, Payne, Price, Rice and others p. 49 http://www.ebooksread.com/authors-eng/minerva-bone-bassett/some-webster-county-kentucky-families---baker-bassett-givens-johnson-payne-ssa/page-6-some-webster-county-kentucky-families---baker-bassett-givens-johnson-payne-ssa.shtml--regivens 06:57, 25 November 2022 (UTC)


The link is to a 1931 letter from the Veterans Administration to researcher Parry Parr. It sets forth that the William Givens who served under Capt. John Givens in the Augusta Co. regiment was born in 1762 in Augusta Co. and moved to Kentucky and was the brother of Capt. John (John Givens 10).

It can be seen at https://1drv.ms/u/s!AjzqPj4Y5W0ZhoJNHhwG2H93zB3rrg?e=rNEwpn--regivens 20:12, 25 November 2022 (UTC)


So this conflicts with Cleek in Early Western Augusta Pioneers:

Image:William_Givens_in_Early_Western_Augusta_Pioneers_pg._357.jpg

This does not surprise me if it is wrong, as Cleek also got John Givens and Margaret Sittlington's son James incorrect. too.... Your thoughts? thanks,

Jim


I have had questions about the accuracy of Cleek's work for years. The William Givens of Bath Co. exists without question. I think it was convenient to pick him as the son of John Givens and Mary Margaret Sittlington as they have a son with his name and he lived in the same general local as his supposed family. The problem is there is no direct evidence that John is the father of this William.

Now the William Givens who ended up in Union Co., KY is a different story. Since he left the Augusta, VA area early researchers may have not even known of him. There is plenty of inferential and semi-direct evidence that he is in fact the son of John and Mary Margaret. Part of the overall confusion in this line was the misidentification of who Capt. John Givens was. Originally everyone assumed it was the John who married Mary Margaret Sittlington but he was quite old to be running around fighting the British. Eventually it was determined that Capt. John Givens was in fact the oldest child of John Givens (1719-1790) and his supposed first wife Margaret Crawford. Why does all this matter? The Revolutionary War pension record of the William of Union Co., KY clearly states that he (William) served under his brother (actually half brother) Capt. John Givens. If he was the brother of Capt. John Givens, then that makes him the brother of the Thomas Givens who vouched for his service in the pension papers (even though the relationship is not set forth in the papers.) This Thomas died in Hopkins Co., KY in 1848. Note the William of Union Co., KY had a son named Thomas Robert Givens. In addition - another sibling of William - my ancestor, Samuel Givens who married Elizabeth Robertson, ended up in Bourbon Co., KY. George Givens, yet another brother who married Isabel Robertson, died in Henderson, KY. Of the other siblings they appear to have stayed in VA or we just just don't know where they died.

To me the gold standard of research on this line (Samuel Givens and Sarah Cathey) is Jane Tyler Reichlein's The Samuel Givens Family and Kin. It isn't perfect but is with few exceptions has the line depicted accurately. I have viewed and copied a lot of the notes of Perry Parr, who was one of Jane's chief collaborators. So for the first two or three generations I have a lot of their notes. I also copied from a cousin in Colorado, Rusty Givens, a notebook full of correspondence between Jane Reichlein and Dorothy Givens Hall (who descended from an unrelated Daniel Givens line from early VA) and others that wrote to her. It is interesting to see how 60+ years ago these researchers were struggling over the same issues we are still pondering today. Bob--regivens 04:53, 28 November 2022 (UTC)


Jim - I just want to give you a shout out of Thanks! You have done a lot of work to clarify the confusion regarding William Givens and I for one want to thank you for all of your efforts. I could never have got all this into We Relate like you have. I really, really appreciate all you are doing. Bob--regivens 05:49, 28 November 2022 (UTC)


John Shields [18 January 2023]

Hello WeRelate,

Any further information or family tree for this person from Augusta/Rockbridge county b. 1748?--Sunnyvalley 15:34, 18 January 2023 (UTC)


Hello SV, can you provide more info on the John Shields you are referencing? I'm not sure who he is...

Thanks much ;0


Question on Frances Michel www.werelate.org/wiki/Person:Francis_Michel_%281%29 [22 January 2023]

Hi Delijim,

First of all, thank you for all of your great information on this site!

My question is about Frances Michel of Germanna in Virginia on this page which I believe you created and maintain: www.werelate.org/wiki/Person:Francis_Michel_%281%29. I am intrigued that he might be the Franz Ludwig Michel, Explorer, described here:www.virginiaplaces.org/settleland/michelle.html.

I have traced some of the information back to the Palantine Project and John Blankenbaker, in particular. It sounds plausible that the Frances Michael in all of the deeds and records in Spotsylvania and Orange may be him.

I am wondering if you have any additional evidence to support the connection to the explorer. For example, do you know if Frances Michael was ever listed as Franz Ludwig Michel or Michael anytime after the 3rd Germanna?

There are some interesting things I've found. For example, the Frances Micheal of Orange and Spotsylvania counties has some ties with William Russell who was in the employ of Alexander Spotswood and a member of the Knights of the Golden Horshoe Expedition. Francis Michael's grandson, Thomas Wright, Jr. married William Russell's sister. And Francis Michael seemed to have made many real estate transactions with important men including Spotswood, Francis Thornton, William Russell, and even Jost Hite. Was it normal for the average Germanna inhabitants to be buying and selling so much land, if you know?

Thanks for any information!

John C. Fox johncfox020@gmail.com--Johncfox020 05:28, 22 January 2023 (UTC)


Thomas Donoho and Jane Amanda Almarode Donoho from Find a grave [2 March 2023]

Hello! You have been credited in Find a Grave for providing specific info on family members that I am researching. Can you tell me where you obtained the information? Thanks, Nancy

235336589 Jane Amanda Almarode Donoho —- According to Delijim, Member # 47671535, she was born on 4 Oct 1819 and her maiden name was spelled Almarode instead of Almonroade.

235336768 Thomas Donoho —- According to Delijim, Member # 47671535, he was born on 7 Nov 1817 in Virginia.--Stoneroad 23:09, 2 March 2023 (UTC)


Robert Leeper and Catherine unk (Armstrong) [1 April 2023]

Person:Robert_Leeper_%283%29

I've been doing a whole lot of research on your Robert Leeper over at WikiTree, his profile used to be mostly blank there. I'd invite you to pick up any of the information I've discovered, including the images, if you'd like. This information should *greatly* expound upon and expand his profile here. Feel free to reformat the information for your profile here as you see fit.

Profile Wikitree Leeper-759

On James Leeper: Person:James_Leeper_%289%29 I've added some information at WikiTree as well as all the image source documents, feel free to pick those up as well. (including the baptism's for two of his children born in the Colonies from the Reverend's notes at Tinkling Springs, his actual Importation Oath, etc) Profile Wikitree Leeper-74

My email address is dougleeper@gmail.com (yes, I am a Leeper...)--Leatherneck 23:52, 1 April 2023 (UTC)


Jacob Dye [14 May 2023]

Hi Delijim - I have a source that puts the parentage of Jacob Dye into question. See: Kentucky: A History of the State, Battle, Perrin, & Kniffin, 3rd ed., 1885, Hardin Co.

DR. GEORGE W. WHITE, a prominent citizen of Elizabethtown, Hardin County, was born November 17, 1827; on Fishing Creek, Pulaski Co., Ky. His maternal grandfather was a soldier in the Revolutionary war from Virginia; married a lady named GORDON and reared a large family of children, one of whom was subject's mother. Thomas White, the father of subject, was born in North Carolina, and when eight years old, in company with his mother and stepfather, came to Kentucky, leaving the rest of his brothers in North Carolina. They located in Casey County, where Thomas grew to manhood, and where he married Miss Tabitha DYE. She was a native of Pulaski County, though of a Virginia family of German origin, and a daughter of a Revolutionary soldier.

This gives that Tabitha' family was of German origin. Since the author mentioned that Tabitha was still living at that time, I think the source is reliable. That lets out all the Virginia Dye families of English origin. There are a couple of other sources that apply: Virginia's Colonial Soldiers by Lloyd DeWitt Bockstruck Page 320 google.ca/books/edition/Virginia_s_Colonial_Soldiers/0RpcjJQBm6AC?hl=en&gbpv=1 Augusta County At a Court Martial Held 15 Sept. 1742 ................. The Return of Capt. Hugh Thompson's Delinquents: ....., Jacob Dye, Abraham Dye....... .............................................. The Trial of Capt. Hugh Thompson's Delinquents: Excused upon their returning and bearing arms under Capt. Hugh Thompson ....., Jacob Dye, Abraham Dye.......

and

Chronicles of the Scotch-Irish settlement in Virginia, extracted from the original court records of Augusta County, 1745-1800, Vol I by Lyman Chalkley. Pub. by Mary S. Lockwood. Page 294 Augusta County Court Judgements babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=hvd.hn4xqt&view=1up&seq=298&skin=2021 Sept 1746 Cornelius Tebout vs. Jacob Dye. — Debt on note dated 30th October, 1734, in New York. Witnessed by Raphael Goelet and Richard Green. [Points to Jacob living in New York as an adult in 1734. Recent New York law permitted lawsuits starting at age 16, similar to the age of majority in Scotland of an earlier period]

This would put the parents in New York or nearby. As for Vincent Dye, I have this from a near defunct website:

Vincent Dye - born in 1726 in Middlesex, County, New Jersey and died on August 4, 1796 in Prince William County, Virginia. Married Sarah Artepe on September 1, 1746 in Middlesex County, New Jersey. She was born on January 9, 1727 in Somerset, New Jersey and died on October 2, 1797 in Prince William, Virginia. He was Ezekiel Dye's uncle. Prince William Co. VA wills, vol H pg 166 - dated January 6 1796, proved April 4, 1796 - names wife Sarah, three youngest sons: Dusoway, Joseph & William; other sons: Daniel, John, Vincent, Enoch, Brown, David and Reuben. Five daughters: Eunice, Rachel, Sarah, Nancy and Caty.

the website is: //uh.edu/~jbutler/gean/johndey.html which gives Vincent's father as John Laurens Dey. I don't believe that Jacob is from the same family, but likely is related - possibly a cousin.

I must congratulate you on a much more accurate view of this family than any other I have seen. I had thought when I first saw the name John given as the parent of Jacob that there may have been a John Dye in the New York/New Jersey Dye families, but I am afraid that it is likely that there are no records of Jacob's parents and I am beginning to think that his father died young. That could explain Jacob going into debt and fleeing to Virginia and joining the Virginia army there. I have a lot of sources dealing with Jacob and his family in Virginia and later, but I expect that you have most of it already.--Paul 21:24, 21 April 2023 (UTC)


James Leeper d.1763 Augusta [10 May 2023]

In 2004, one of the old County Down, Northern Ireland Registers was degrading to the point the pages were falling apart. Mary Armstrong transcribed the entire register. When they were getting the house ready, Julian Armstrong found the transcribed register work. It was sent to Belfast, but they did not want it. Ros Davies put the entire work upon her website. I have gotten permission to use this information for family tree work on Ancestry, WikiTree, etc.

In this County Down Register is found James Leeper, who produced a testimonial from Rev Charles Seaton to the minister at Ballynahinch Presbyterian Church 12 Oct 1716. He married Margaret Curry 22 Dec 1718 at Ballynahinch Presbyterian Church, Rev Henry Livingston.

Furthermore it states: Nicholas, baptized 12 Nov 1720 Sarah, baptized 5 Jan 1723 Jane, baptized 7 Mar 1725 Andrew, baptized 20 Jul 1728

Further inquiry into seeing if maybe this section survived, and get original pictures, unfortunately the pages are all in little pieces, and they are not able to even handle the register..

Image is here, along with link to the records on Ros Davies website: contact me for details

This fits perfectly with James Leeper of Augusta and his Importation Oath (which also states he came from Ireland, if you look closely at the original that can be found in Orange County Book 2), as well as the Headwrights where John Smith is listed.

Unlike what others have said, in your page, obviously the children were not baptized here, but in Ireland. However, the last two children were baptized at Tinkling Springs and the record is in the Rev.'s notes.

I have put a copy of it (image) at WikiTree, I do not know how to put here on this site.

I have a great many copies of original records and the required sources with their URLs imbedded in the images here, if you have access to Ancestry.com: contact me for details

You will also find copies of my Leeper Y-DNA Project, where I have tracked down descendants of various Leeper lines and discovered that James Leeper and "brother" Robert Leeper, whom James son Nicholas came down and bought land from his Uncle on the Catawba River, James son James also came down and purchased land from Fredrick Hambright, so all the Leepers lived not far apart. In any case, the Y-DNA shows they carried the same Haplogroup clear down to the Y-700, the deepest level of testing for Y-DNA SNPs.

I've done much deep study and research into his brother Robert now, details may be found here: contact me for details (if you know just who James Patton was in Augusta, you might find a note about Robert Leeper there, quite interesting). You do have my permission to use any of the information I have put in my Ancestry tree or up on WikiTree, should you like. This is also the Robert Leeper whom was married to Catherine Armstrong, of note, refer to Matthew Armstrong's Will d.1779 Lincoln Co, NC.

It should be noted that there were also several James Leepers that descended from a cousin line, in PA, and often folks get these Leeper lines all mixed up. If it was not for my also Y-DNA tracing the PA Leepers through their descendants, it would have been quite the chore to untangle it all...--Leatherneck 07:31, 10 May 2023 (UTC)


Witton family [8 July 2023]

Are you looking for information on William A Witton and Mary A. Witton? Please email me of so, I will probably not check this to see a reply. I don't have a lot, but may be something you could use. Thanks Tammy

Tam2333@aol.com--Pedsrn 13:51, 8 July 2023 (UTC)


Campbell's of Borden's Grant, VA [5 November 2023]

Hi there.

I have an interest in the early Campbell families in Augusta County, VA and am trying to piece together their difficult lineage.

I'm particularly inquiring about Leticia Allison (supposedly 1759-1844 per ThruLines on Ancestry), married to James Campbell, as you noted here: werelate.___ org/wiki/Person:Leticia_Allison_%281%29

(you need to remove the triple_ underscore and stitch the links together)

I have seen on Ancestry that Letitia Allison was also married to Charles Campbell (supposedly 1750-1825). Look here: ancestry___ .com___ /family-tree/person/tree/158136350/person/142497774566/facts

I am thinking that James and Charles were brothers, as indicated on this map that shows adjacent land ownership in the Borden Grant. Look here: werelate.___ org/wiki/Image:CampbellGilbertBordenSW389acres.JPG

Question - Do you have any information to support the brother relationship of James and Charles? I know there were multiple Charles's, including a father & son in the area.

Any help you can provide will be wonderful. Thank you very much!

My direct email is I am , TX.--Bigtex 13:20, 26 October 2023 (UTC)


Followup to Campbell's of Augusta County, VA [27 October 2023]

Deleted - I added my response to your previous reply/thread since I figured out how to do that. Thank you.

--Bigtex 16:12, 27 October 2023 (UTC)