User talk:Artefacts


Welcome [28 February 2015]

Welcome to WeRelate, your virtual genealogical community. We're glad you have joined us. At WeRelate you can easily create ancestor web pages, connect with cousins and other genealogists, and find new information. To get started:

If you need any help, we will be glad to answer your questions. Just go to the Support page, click on the Add Topic link, type your message, then click the Save Page button. Thanks for participating and see you around! --Support 19:24, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

So pleased that you have responded....wasn't sure I would be able to find you :-)

No Nancy Ann Miller/Clapp is not a niece of Philip Roblin...she is a niece of John Roblin...and I am assuming that is the husband of Sarah Wessels and brother to Stephen Roblin. Some say that Philip and Owen Roblin are cousins to John and Stephen Roblin...may be true, may not....I have considered that they could be siblings. But the Roblin's are a whole other story.

In the Hay Bay records it says that Joseph Clapp is the brother-in-law to Elizabeth Miller/Roblin. This is part of what I based my premise that Nancy Ann Clapp is actually Ann Miller. Along with the names of children in the Miller siblings families....many named Nancy Ann.

I have seen the assumption that Ann Carpenter is the d/o Garret Miller also. And have seen that she has an affadavit that states she is the sister of Mary Miller/Miller w/o Peter Miller.

Had not considered that Nancy Ann Miller/Clapp might have married John Carpenter after the death of Joseph Clapp but the problem there is that Joseph Clapp does not die until 1813 and Ann Miller and John Carpenter have a son Ashram born in 1801.

Will look at your message re the Garrison's some more....I am much less familiar with the Garrison families.

Looking forward to talking with you via the home email.

Thanks, Linda Herman--Lherman49 00:18, 28 February 2015 (UTC)

A will for George Fowler....not that is very interesting and would love to see that one.

I looked for Patience and George Fowler and found then in 1790 in New Cornwall with 2 sons under 16. I wondered if one might have been Jeremiah who I have not been able to trace....but it looks like Patience and George had at least one son of their own if not two.

Really looking forward to exploring this with you.

Linda--Lherman49 00:24, 28 February 2015 (UTC)

GEDCOM Export Ready [20 October 2013]

The GEDCOM for tree Default is ready to download. Click here.

Michael Dowd & Catherine O'Keeffe [13 November 2013]

Hi Artefacts,

I've just seen your WeRelate entry on Michael Dowd and his wives, Mary Reynolds and Catherine O'Keeffe. I believe Michael and Catherine are my great-grandparents, but their youngest daughter Catherine (my late grandmother) is not listed after Eva on your account of the family. I believe Catherine was the only member of the family to remain in Ireland, as I have always heard that all her siblings emigrated to the USA (though I'm not sure if this relates to her full siblings only or to all her step-siblings too).

I would be happy to share the information and sources I have with you, since you have provided me with so much material I was unaware of!

Regards, DeepSleeper--DeepSleeper 22:58, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

[16 March 2014]


I have been reading through the recent discussion with interest, wondering how to add my two cents' worth, when I noted your Ontario examples. So this note is partly a hello from another WR user with an Ontario family. There aren't that many of us about.

I didn't know that the French Canadian priests messed up the Irish homelands, but I think the Irish ones who came out to help them paid them back by misspelling places in Quebec. Have you seen WR's list of Quebec places? (I think that someone decided adding the accents was more important than getting the organization straight.)

The problems of French Canadian and Irish priests providing information on their congregations merged in Mara Township (previously in Ontario County, now part of Ramara in Simcoe). An early contribution to WR has probably provided us with the whole Roman Catholic population of Mara Township. The inconsistencies there are beyond belief.

I joined WeRelate in 2012. With almost half my family Ontario-born back to 1800 I soon found out that WR needed some education in how the province went together. Members from south of the border did not appear to have considered the concept that some state-equivalent places changed their names during the 19th century, much less did they realize that alterations to municipalities might occur post-1970. I was challenged numerous times with the problem of presenting WR with a birthplace such as [[Place:Markham (township), York, Upper Canada, Canada]] or [[Place:Pickering (township), Ontario, Canada West, Canada]]. Each time I hoped the automatic pipe would put it in the right place. It didn't always happen because the database had been poorly drawn up.

Consequently I decided to spend several months of 2012 sorting out Ontario placepages (you have no idea of the number of familiar places which were in the "unknown" category when I started), county by county. One of my first work experiences in Toronto was to learn the townships in each Ontario county. Little did I know then how useful this knowledge would be once I discovered genealogy. I don’t live in Canada any more and it was a bit of a shock to discover that since 1970 the counties had been asked to reorganize themselves and they have done so in a myriad of ways, sometimes twice.

I now live in England and last year I decided to sort out place pages for various counties in the UK. Guess what? They also decided to change the municipal organization in the 1970s, but the whole country had to do it together in 1974. Some places didn't like it and have gone back to the old names or something part way between the old and the new. Great fun!

Sorting out modern place-naming from a distance has been made worse by the fact that the world wide web was discovered and put to use just after these post-1970 alterations were put into place. Many Wikipedia articles and municipal websites present the current facts and forget to mention the changes that have occurred in the past 50 years. Digging for the facts has sometimes been very time consuming. Try telling someone under 40 from Oshawa that Whitby used to be in Ontario County! Yes, Ontario is now a confusing name for a county, but before 1867 it would have been perfectly acceptible.

Regards --Goldenoldie 19:35, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

Weather [16 March 2014]

Gee, Hasn't it thawed out in TO yet? It's spring here. Daffodils in bloom, birds singing their hearts out at 7am, going outside without a coat, the lot!

Our family stopped supplying people to be related to in the 1930s. I was an only grandchild. But in studying the Keffers (a study that started by correcting placenames on WeRelate and expanded to add 19th century census entries) I discovered that three Keffer men married girls named Quantz (from Markham Township) and so did the sister of my great-great grandmother (well, she married the brother of at least one of them). /cheers --Goldenoldie 21:28, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

References; Atkinson Family [30 June 2014]


I saw your query on the Support page about using references on PlacePages and was wondering how you employed it. It might be useful on some of the many placepages I set up.

Then, looking at the people in your tree, I saw that you have an Ambrose Atkinson in Northumberland, Ontario. My great-great grandfather, Ambrose Atkinson (1818-1898), lived in "old" Ontario County from 1847 till his death. I don't see any obvious links when comparing the two trees--even the fact that they both happened to marry a woman named Mitchell is probably no more than a coincidence. (In my gg-gf's case his second wife's first married name was Mitchell.)

/cheers --Goldenoldie 10:57, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Hello again Goldenoldie! I am working on setting up informal templates for sections of place pages using my wikipedia formatting knowledge (doesn't always work here). I might try to turn them into actual formatting templates if I figure out how to program those. Right now I am building: Timeline, Demographic statistical tables, and Source coverage tables. I am doing this in the place page for Place:Creech St Michael, where I also just created a Source Citations section and got help getting refs to list there if you want to take a look. Using refs helps reduce the clutter and size of tables (and also makes it more encyclopedic). Once I have tested out how well these templates work, I hope to deploy them in a template for creating townland pages in the Irish Townlands Project (I am moving somewhat slowly on that as I figure out how best to research townlands, also, huge volumes) which may be similar to your Scottish work. Will look into Ambrose in a moment (on wrong computer) and see if I can down trace the next generation to look for a connection! --Artefacts 16:50, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Parameters in Templates [10 October 2014]

You asked earlier about how to add parameters to a template so that the number of transcriptions, etc could be passed to the template.

If you look at the FindAGrave template you will see an example of how to pass parameters. If you have any questions, perhaps I can help you sort it out.

Rick----RGMoffat 18:02, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

Hi Rick, I did find and exemplar and think I have it figure out, just need some time ... --Artefacts 22:21, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

Children of Garret Miller [27 February 2015]

Hi, I have found your information re William Garrison and Nancy Miller on We Relate. I am a long time Roblin researcher and have been working on the Miller family over the last month. I am very interested on how you determined that Nancy Miller might be Ann Miller d/o Garret.

I too have been looking at Ann Miller. There have been two camps....those who thought she was Nancy Ann Miller who married John Carpenter and went to Virginia....the only support they have for this is that Nancy Ann has been proven to be a sister to Mary Miller who married Peter Miller and that they came from Orange County. The other camp believes that Nancy Ann Miller w/o Joseph Clapp is the d/o Garret. I have worked to prove the later.This is what I come up with and what I have posted:

I think we have enough small bits of evidence to be able to say that Nancy Ann Clapp was the daughter of Garret Miller and sister to Elizabeth Roblin.

1) The Hay Bay Church records saying Joseph Clapp was brother-in-law to Elizabeth Roblin (this is strong evidence) 2) the shared Crown Patent in Richmond held by Joseph Clapp and Hampton Miller (brother to Elizabeth and Nancy Ann) 3) Joseph and Ann naming a daughter Patience, after her mother, a daughter Sarah, after her sister, a son Philip after her brother-in-law, Philip Roblin, a son George, after her step-father, a son Samuel after her brother, and a son Joseph after her husband and a son James, after Joseph's brother. 4) sister Elizabeth names a daughter Nancy Ann 5) brother Samuel names a daughter Nancy Ann..and a son Joseph after his brother-in-law, Joseph Clapp. 6) sister Sarah names a daughter Nancy

The other candidate for Nancy Ann d/o Garrett and Patience is Nancy Ann Miller/Carpenter and they go to Virginia which does not make sense for this family and none of the names of their children are similar to those of the Garret Miller children.

Looking at Garret Millers will he lists his children Joshua, Mary, Elizabeth, Garrett, Nathan, Sarah, Samuel, Anne, Hampton, and Jeremiah......and usually in the will the children are listed in order of age or boys first in order of age and then girls in order of age. It looks like Mary is the oldest daughter therefore born before 1754 the date of Elizabeth's birth which would make Mary Miller w/o Peter Miller who is born 1762 too young to be our Mary. And it is only because Ann Carpenter and Mary Miller w/o Peter Miller are sisters that people have placed them in the family of Garret Miller....which was a Miller family with daughters Ann and Mary.

I think we have found as much as there is to be found....but I also think that we have enough to say with confidence that Nancy Ann Clapp is "Ann Miller".

Both Absolam and Phoebe were dead by 1777....that leaves only Mary and Jeremiah unaccounted for. It is interesting to note that there are two boys under 16 living with George Fowler and Patience in may be Jeremiah but it looks like George and Patience had at least one son if not two. She was only 39 at the time of Garrett's death so I guess that makes sense. Can't find any sons for them though.

HOWEVER, I am still very interested to know how you connected Catherine Miller w/o William Garrison to Garret Miller. I am still looking for Mary Miller and have considered that if there is a connection that Catherine Miller COULD BE Mary Catherine Miller.....a very long shot but worth considering. I do see that the name Catherine comes up in the names of some of the siblings of Mary Miller: Sarah names a daughter Katie, Samuel names a daughter Catherine, Nancy Ann and Joseph Clapp name a daughter Catherine, Hampton names a daughter Katherine...but not Elizabeth, though she names a daughter Mary. William Garrison and Nancy Miller name a son Garrett and a daughter Nancy.

Would really like to talk to you about this. The easiest way would be with my home email,

You are the only person I have come across that makes a connection of Catherine Miller to Garrett Miller and I would be extremely happy if I could prove or at least support this.

Linda Herman--Lherman49 20:03, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Linda, I'll send an email (we are multiple cousins by the way and I have many, many notes based on stuff you posted on the web). For record here: I think Ann Miller, daughter of Garret and Patience was born after 1765 in Monroe NY, married William Garrison in that area and had three sons before coming to Canada where she had her daughter Nancy Garrison who grew up to marry Samuel Badgely. If I have posted Nancy Millar Clapp's info here, I was confused at that time (will have to find it and fix it) -- I worked through the possibilities and Nancy Millar cannot be a niece of Philip Roblin via his wife Elizabeth, she must be a Roblin niece because of generation dates.

I know William Garrison died in 1795 from his sons UCLand Petition and I believe Ann returned to Monroe at that time and married a Carpenter. I think it is extremely likely that she would have moved to Virginia at that point because her sisters Mary and Sarah had already done so. Do you have the Revolutionary War Pension application for Sara Miller Burgess? This is the contrary proof to your argument, but I have not seen it. The evidence I have for sorting out the Ann/Catherine Miller Garrison mess is the will of Patience's second husband, George Fowler, which left bequests to his wife's son Hampton and the same wife's grandson Garret Garrison. I have posted a direct link on his page here, with extensive explanation in the family page (I'll send the links in an email as I can't navigate away from this edit page). Basically I think Rev. Silas Constant routinely forgot who he had married and may have gotten names wrong by the time he wrote his activities in his diary and he misrecorded Ann as "Catherine." I worked through the Garrisons last year and am researching the Millers and the Roblins for a book and when I hit the Fowler will, everything was fresh in my head and I knew who Garret Garrison was and checked Constant's record accuracy to see if he could have screwed up on "Catherine Miller" married to William Garrison and I do think so, based on gaps in his records and descriptions of his extensive travels. --Artefacts 23:30, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Your User page [3 April 2016]

I notice that your introductory paragraphs are not wrapping to the next line, but continue off the right hand side of the page. This is most unusual, even when copying and pasting. If these were sorted out, it would be easier for others to read.

Your personal research projects are in places that I recognize as being in Ontario, but some of them could be easily taken to be in England by those with more English roots than Ontario ones. You could attach each of these placenames to WR's place database.

Regards, --Goldenoldie 08:30, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

Ontario-bred, England resident.