Person talk:Cincinnati Williams (1)

Family Notes of User:JgWEST2008

[The notes below were originally posted on the main Person Page in 2008. They have been moved here to keep them with the record.]--cos1776 19:31, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

(EDT)20:27, 18 May 2008 (EDT) JgWEST2008

From: "Jack & Sally Boswell" <jboswell@@wku.campus.mci.net> To: "John G. West" <mylines@@evansville.net> Subject: Cincinnati O. West Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 18:51:34 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3

Hi John,

It would be nice if we could solve the name problem of Cincinnati O. West. I had her down as being a Martin, which I took from the Todd Co. marriage records. "William E. West to C. O. Martin" 14 April 1848. (I think you had 26 Aug 1848). Where did you get your date? Since P. O. Martin is one of my ancestors, I just assumed that Cincinnati was a Martin. Our library has just acquired Kentucky death records on micro-film (to 1946), so I went up today and found death records for Jesse Harrison West, Warner West, and P. O. Martin. On Jesse H. and Warner's records, they do say that she was a Williams. Oh!! If we only knew.

My grandfather James Dekater O'Daniel, living with his grandmother Susannah (Blackston) O'Daniel in 1850 census, later married a James Williams. Susannah was married to a Joshua O'Daniel in NC, and possible Joshua died while on way to Kentucky. The Joshua in the 1850 Census who married Nancy E. Colvin, is her son. James D. O'Daniel death certificate says that his father was Joshua, and his mother was a Jennie Williams. There is a Jane E. Thompson living with this family, who we think is the mother of my grandfather. Susannah Blackston O'Daniel did marry a James Williams later, so I think this is where grandmother O'Daniel got this.

Why do you think Cincinnati was an O'Daniel? Back then, they rarely used the maiden name of the woman, so I just thought this was an initial for her middle name.

Enough of this. My mind will only absorb so much genealogy in a day, and I've been on this all afternoon. BUT!! We'll keep working on this.

Sally Boswell ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

At 01:43 PM 3/20/99 -0700, you wrote:

>Hi! >I read your response on the Christian Co. KY Query Forum and we might have a >relation. My husband grew up in the Pilot Rock area, & went to church at >Ebenezer Baptist Church. His uncles still run the Powell family farm, Pilot >Rock borders their land. > >I have just started working on my husband's family tree so unfortunately I >probably will not be much help to you. But if I can I will share what I >have. So if Tim is a relation I was hoping you would share your >information. > >On the West line, I have Tim's father James Elton West, then Charles Warner >West, then Marion West. Any one sound familiar? > >O'Daniel I have only one name, his g-grand-mother Kitty Cincinnati O'Daniel >married John William Hickman Lindsey on Oct 21, 1874 in Christian County. >Since Cincinnati is an uncommon name there may be a relation between Kitty >Cincinnati O'Daniel and your Cincinnati O. Williams. > >Hope to hear from you soon, >Johanna West >

Christian Co., KY 1870 US Census as compiled and published by A.B. Willhite, 1995 (page 1) Household 11: Odaniel, Joshua 45MW, Nancy 46FW, Joshua 19MW, Kittie C. 17FW, Sarah E. 17FW, Layfayette B. 13MW, Calvin, Rachel 30FW.

HSHD # 9: West, William E. 45MW, Cincinnati 44FW, Mary I. 18FW, John W. 14MW, Jesse Hanson 6MW, Tucker, Joshing 22MW (Farm Laborer).

[John William West is my Great Grandfather). Well off to the library (Willard Library is Indiana's 3rd. best Genealogical Library and with the Fort Wayne Library that is saying something). JGW ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Johanna, the plot thickens! <grin>

In the 1860 Christian Co., KY US Census Book, published by the Hopkins Co. Genealogical Society, Inc., 1978: I have found the only O'Daniel family in household #634 - Joshua O'Daniel (place of Kitty's marriage, possible father) -Joshua 38m, Nancy 39f, J.W. 16m, A.V. 15m, Susan V. 12f, J.P. 10m, R.C 6f, (this may be K.C.), S.S. 6f (twins?), Lafayette 2m, & Rachael CALVAIN 26f (all Born KY). After church, I will send you the 1870 Census - we both will like it! JGW

At 01:43 PM 3/20/99 -0700, you wrote: >Hi! >I read your response on the Christian Co. KY Query Forum and we might have a >relation. My husband grew up in the Pilot Rock area, & went to church at >Ebenezer Baptist Church. His uncles still run the Powell family farm, Pilot >Rock borders their land. > >I have just started working on my husband's family tree so unfortunately I >probably will not be much help to you. But if I can I will share what I >have. So if Tim is a relation I was hoping you would share your >information. > >On the West line, I have Tim's father James Elton West, then Charles Warner >West, then Marion West. Any one sound familiar? > >O'Daniel I have only one name, his g-grand-mother Kitty Cincinnati O'Daniel >married John William Hickman Lindsey on Oct 21, 1874 in Christian County. >Since Cincinnati is an uncommon name there may be a relation between Kitty >Cincinnati O'Daniel and your Cincinnati O. Williams. > >Hope to hear from you soon, >Johanna West

From Christian Co., KY list on Rootsweb (KYCHRIST-L)

Betty, you are really a very special person! You may have uncovered the link to get over that brick wall for the family of Cincinnati O. Williams (or maybe Martin?) who married William Ellis West over in Todd Co. in 1848.

  "Mrs. Mildred Martin was the guest of her sister, Mrs. W. E. West, last

Saturday and Sunday."

Don't know if Mrs. W.E. West is Mrs. William Ellis West (Cincinnati) or not, but I am willing to check this out.

Does anyone think they know anything about this Mrs. Mildred Martin - the sister of Mrs. W.E. West? Thanks, Betty for the new clue!!! John G. West

Another message --- Well, Betty will always be special, but maybe not as much as I was thinking in my previous message! :) Although we do not know where Mrs. Mildred Martin is from, I did find two from Christian County alone in the 1900 Census published & compiled by A. B. Willhite. On page 531, there is a Mildred E. Martin, wife of John J. - she was born in 1861. Then on page 628, I found another Mildred with initial "N" who is the wife of James R. Martin and she was born in 1866. Now, interesting enough this "Mildred" lives next door to Thomas Lanier who has a daughter Ida N. who is the wife of William E. West (Ida was born in 1879). My Cincinnati was born in 1825 and would more than likely not be the sister of either of these Mildred Martin women. Now, Ida is a "Mrs. W. E. West" and Mildred although 13 years older could be the sister of Ida. Seems odd that she would be listed in the newspaper as the guest of her sister who lived next door, but these old "gossip" type columns mentioned anything that happen in the communities that they covered! The Mildred mentioned in the column could be a lady from somewhere else; however, if Mrs. James R. Martin was the daughter of Thomas Lanier - I would say that we had found our Mildred Martin and she would not be the sister of Cincinnati, but rather Ida's sister!  :( JGW

I have been checking some more. In the two volume "Marriage Records of Christian Co., KY 1851-1900" by Cordelia Gary copyrighted 1970. I did not find a marriage record for James R. Martin to a "Mildred N." I did find that a Mildred A. Lanier married a Robert Martin 28 Dec 1884. There was also a Mildred V. Lanier that married a R. A. Murphey 15 May 1895. John J. Martin married Mildred E. Hamby 10 Mar 1887. Now James R. Martin may be James Robert Martin and listed as Robert Martin when he married Mildred A. Lanier. It sorta looks like Mrs. Mildred Martin is the sister of Ida N. Lanier who married a "W. E. West" and my Cincinnati O. Williams (or Martin) who married William Ellis West in 1848 is still a brick wall for me! :( JGW

There is some confusion about the maiden name of Cincinnati O. West. Her 1848 Todd Co., KY marriage record to William Ellis West indicates she was C. O. Martin.

The 1947 KY death certificate # 10479 of her son, John William West indicates his mother's maiden name was Cincinnati "WILLIAMS" and his father was Ellis West.

Reference page 87, Christian Co., KY Vital Statistics, 1852-1861 compiled by Shirley West Cain indicates that the mother of Mary A. West, born 11 Jan 1852 in Todd Co., KY was Cincinnati O. "WILLIAMS", wife of William E. (Ellis) West.

Reference page 20, household # 91-92 of the 1850 Todd Co., KY census where William Ellis and Cincinnati O. West are living next door (household # 92-93) to Susanna Grisham (Braxton) (O'Daniel) (Williams) widow of Abner Braxton, Joshua O'Daniel, and James Williams. If Cincinnati was a "WILLIAMS", she could be the daughter of James Jr. Williams and Susanna Grisham Williams; but this is unproven as yet. James Jr. Williams was the son of James Sr. Williams and Nancy West of NC.

- From Tommy Henderson's PAF database "TomHen" notes for Cincinnati Williams/Martin. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

West Family Genealogy Forum (GenForum) Cincinnati O. Williams/Martin/West of KY Posted by: John G. West Date: August 06, 2000 at 09:41:28 4135 of 7168

We have an old mystery concerning my gggrandmother Cincinnati of Christian & Todd Counties of KY - What really was her maiden name and who are her parents?

Listed as C.O. Martin on marriage license to William Ellis West (b.13 Sep 1822 - d.21 Jun 1896) dated 14 Apr 1848 (Todd Co., KY). The only known reference to the name Martin is on the marriage record. Her son (my ggrandfather), John William West's 1947 death certificate - she is listed as Cincinnati Williams. On son's 1942 Death Certificate [Jesse Harrison West] she is listed as Cincinnati Williams, b. Christian Co. as his mother. On daughter, Mary Bell Tucker's death certificate (1925), she is listed as "Nat" Williams; "Nat" is written above the crossed out "Sinat" (that is what everyone called her - "Sinat" and sometimes "Nat"!). She is often listed as Cincinnati O. West or C.O. West. The long-time Todd Co., KY County Clerk (where William Ellis West and Cincinnati were married) was P.O. Martin. When the marriage record was entered it may have been just habit to enter "Martin" after the "C.O." or she had been married to a Martin or the children's informants in 1925, 1942 & 1947 were incorrect??????????

The only thing I could get from my family as to who was even related to Cincinnati was that she was a "cousin" of Fate O'Daniel ["Fate" nickname for "Lafayette"?]. Sally Boswell has sent me some info concerning O'Daniels with Williams connections, but I have not been able to unravel it, either! From Sally: "My grandfather James Dekater O'Daniel, living with his grandmother Susannah (Blackston) O'Daniel in 1850 census, later married a James Williams. Susannah was married to a Joshua O'Daniel in NC, and possible Joshua died while on way to Kentucky. The Joshua in the 1850 Census who married Nancy E. Colvin, is her son. James D. O'Daniel death certificate says that his father was Joshua, and his mother was a Jennie Williams. There is a Jane E. Thompson living with this family, who we think is the mother of my grandfather. Susannah Blackston O'Daniel did marry a James Williams later, so I think this is where grandmother O'Daniel got this."

Johanna West sent me this: "Kitty Cincinnati O'Daniel married John William Hickman Lindsey on Oct 21, 1874 in Christian County. Since Cincinnati is an uncommon name there may be a relation between Kitty Cincinnati O'Daniel and your Cincinnati O. Williams." Kitty Cincinnati has a brother named Lafayette!!!!!

Christian Co., KY 1870 US Census as compiled and published by A.B. Willhite, 1995 (page 1): HSHD #11: Odaniel, Joshua 45MW, Nancy 46FW, Joshua 19MW, Kittie C. 17FW, Sarah E. 17FW (twins?), Layfayette B. 13MW, Calvin, Rachel 30FW. HSHD #9: West, William E. 45MW, Cincinnati 44FW, Mary I. 18FW, John W. 14MW, Jesse Hanson 6MW, Tucker, Joshing 22MW (Farm Laborer). [John William West (14) is my Great Grandfather).

In the 1860 Christian Co., KY US Census Book, published by the Hopkins Co. Genealogical Society, Inc., 1978: I have found the only O'Daniel family in household #634 - Joshua O'Daniel (place of Kitty's marriage, possible father) -Joshua 38m, Nancy 39f, J.W. 16m, A.V. 15m, Susan V. 12f, J.P. 10m, R.C 6f, (this may be K.C.), S.S. 6f (twins?), Lafayette 2m, & Rachael CALVAIN 26f (all Born KY).

We can not find a death certificate for her even though she died according to her tombstone on 16 May 1912 - in where else but O'Daniel Cemetery near the West farm where she lived!!! She is listed in the 1910 Census for Christian Co., KY (Cincinnatie O. West 83 Widow 4 of 5 children living).

The database that I am referencing lists Gillison Price Williams married three times: Elizabeth C. Meacham 29 Mar 1867; Telitha Artimessie Powell 15 Oct 1875; Minerva Adeline (aka - Mary Ann) Powell 07 Sep 1887 Ch. by Elizabeth: Lillie Ada b. abt 1869 and Charles Thurston Williams b. 12 Jan 1871; Ch. by Telitha: Minnie J. 05 Aug 1876, James G. 15 May 1878, Marcell E. 19 Mar 1880, Pinkney W. 09 Jan 1882, Susan A. 13 Apr 1884 and Benjamin W. Williams 02 Jun 1886; Ch. by Minerva: Nora 07 Mar 1889 and Eunice Williams 04 Aug 1891.

Telitha Artimessie and her younger sister Minerva Adeline were daughters of William Briston Powell and Elizabeth Lacy. Gillison Price Williams was born 13 Jan 1831 and died 22 May 1917 Christian Co., KY for both dates. Marcell married John W. Williams and died in 1940.

James Williams, Jr (may 1806 - bef. 1850) married Susannah Grissam/Grisham (abt. 1791 - aft. 1884) on 24 Apr 1823. He was almost 17 and she was about 32 - so, there may be some sort of error on dates or of persons involved. They had four children: Arena, Selina A., Merrill Washington and James C. Williams (nickname - King). Susannah had married second (12 Dec 1813) Joshua S. O'Daniel, Sr. having four children with him: Polly, Jane, Sarah and Joshua, Jr. Susannah married first Abner Braxton apparently in Orange Co., NC about 1811. This James Williams, Jr. is listed as the son of James Williams, Sr. and Nancy West.

As you may recall, I have a Cincinnati O. Williams or Martin that is my great, great grandmother she was born Dec 1825 according to the US Census and died 16 May 1912 according to her tombstone in the O'Daniel Cemetery and married William Ellis West (son of Jesse West and Mary Bright Rogers) 14 Apr 1848 in Todd County. In the marriage papers, she was listed as C.O. Martin (the Todd Co. Clerk at the time was P.O. Martin and I believe it was written in error). Two of her children's death certificates list her maiden name as Williams; however, she was old enough to have married a Martin before her marriage to William Ellis West! Anyhow, I do not know who her parents are. Interestingly, C.O.'s first child was Susan Selina West that married James G. Edwards 11 Apr 1866.

I have been checking in my database and notice that James Williams and Susannah were married early enough to have been the parents of Cincinnati. If this were true Joshua O'Daniel, Jr. and her would have been born next to one another as half brother and sister. Joshua had a daughter he named after his mother and the next daughter was Kitty Cincinnati. His youngest child is Lafayette Belle O'Daniel nicknamed "Fate." The only person anyone in my family could name for sure that was on her side of the family was a "cousin" named Fate O'Daniel. My Cincinnati had a daughter named Mary Belle West. Joshua's daughter Susan V. O'Daniel married Aaron Tucker and had Laura Bell Tucker who married Monroe Lee O'Daniel and had daughter Martha Louise O'Daniel who married Melvin West, grandson of Cincinnati through my ancestor John William West and Hester Ann Martin. Melvin's older brother was Warner West, my grandfather. Monroe O'Daniel was the grandson of Joshua O'Daniel, Jr. (son of Joshua and Susannah). Just one more item, another son of Joshua, Jr. (brother to Susan V., Kitty Cincinnati and 'Fate') was Aaron Virgil O'Daniel who had a son named "Cleveland Vernice O'Daniel." Sorry, one more... my aunt, Dad's sister is Doris Vernell West! There is some serious circumstances that suggest a stronger possibility than I thought that Susannah Grissam/Grisham and James Williams, Sr. are Cincinnati's parents. And that has been a brickwall for over 30 years for me! John At 11:08 AM 1/26/2004 -0500, you wrote:

Hello John. We haven't corresponded for a good while. I haven't done any genealogy now to speak of, for about 5 years, but I have been keeping up with KyChrist.

Question: On your response to Kristen, you have that Stephen Williams, b. June 5, 1798, son of James & Nancy West Williams, married Jane Henderson. My records show that this Stephen and Jane Henderson had a son named Gillison Price Williams, b. 1831. He married Telitha Artimessie Powell. I only have one child listed: Marshell E. Williams, b. 1880.

Who would be the father of Gillison Price? Can you shed some light on this?

On another note, my great grandmother was either Susannah O'Daniel or Aretta who married a James Williams I would love to find out which James this is. It has been a thorn in my side for 30 years now.

Good to correspond with you again. My husband died in 2001 and I moved to Lexington, Ky to be near my oldest daughter. In fact, I have moved twice in 2 years, and my records are here and there. My daughter and I started up a Home Decor & Gift shop in 2002, so I have not been keeping up with my genealogy. If you get the chance, look at our website. www.SimplElegance.com

Some additional information. Gillison Williams and Elizabeth are living 3 doors from my Cincinnati in the 1870 Census for Christian Co., KY with his daughter Lillie A. and his sister Nancy and brother Rowland. Joshua O'Daniel & wife, Nancy Calvin, is living 2 doors on the other side of Cincinnati with children Kitty C., Lafayette B. and others. Joshua's daughter, Susan V. O'Daniel married Aaron Tucker and Aaron's brother, Joshua C. Tucker married Mary Belle West, Cincinnati's daughter. Mary and Joshua Tucker had a daughter named Kitty Crowley Tucker!

Susanna Williams(87) is in the Kirkmansville Dist. of the 1880 Todd Co. US Census taken 3 Jun 1880 Hshd. 30 family 30 by herself. Family 31 is in the same household and is her son, James C. Williams & family. In the 1870 Todd Co. US Census she is living in the same Hshd. With her son, James C. Williams and two other females aged 40 and 50. Her age this time is 89!!! One of the two census is in error on her age. In the 1860 Todd Co. US Census she is only 65. She is only 49 in the 1850 Todd County Census without a husband there is listed Jane 30, Arena 25, Selana 19, Washington 15, Jas. 13. living next door is Ellis West 28, Cincinnati 22, and Susan 2. This would make Cincinnati born about 1828 and she would fit in rather well between Arena & Selana. The 1870 Census in Christian Co. has her listed as 44 being born about 1826 - still between Arena and Selena.

I think by circumstantial evidence that Cincinnati is the daughter of James Williams and Susannah Grissam/Grisham. Now I need to do extensive research on this James Williams and I might be able to prove it.