Family talk:Liberty Irish and Judith Jenkins (1)

Were they married? [24 November 2014]

Were they ever married? Liberty and Judith are not in the same household in the 1850, 1860 or 1870 censuses. It would appear that Amanda and Eve are the same person, and she is listed with Judith in the 1850 census. The census data suggest that Judith had one child after her husband died (by whom, of course, is not revealed in the census records), and never remarried.

This is not my line - this family simply caught my eye because of the error in Maria's record, which I have fixed. But I got curious and started poking around. I wasn't able to track down the divorce record online.--DataAnalyst 00:08, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

I do agree that Amanda and Eve are the same person. The July 1850 Federal census lists Amanda in the Judith Irish household as age 6 months for a birthdate of around Jan 1850. The 1919 death certificate of Eve (Irish) Terry in Oakland County, Michigan lists birthdate of 2 Jan 1850. It also lists her father as Norman Irish. (As Norman died in 1846 this cannot be her correct father.) Her mother’s name is not listed. The Jan 1850 birthdate ties both of these together and makes it quite clear that Eve and Amanda are the same person.

The parentage of Eve/Amanda is more complicated, but we gain useful information from Divorce cases filed in Oakland County.

For example; on 28 Jan 1848 Sarah Jane Irish filed for divorce from Liberty B Irish. She alleges an adulterous relationship her husband is having with Judith Irish (the widow of Liberty’s brother, Norman, who died in June 1846 from ‘the kick of a horse’). She alleges that this relationship began in Mar 1847. She further states that he became intimate or strongly attached to Judith beginning in July 1846. This case was apparently dropped.

A second case was filed by Sarah Jane on 7 Jun 1853. In this case Sarah Jane alleges that Liberty is recognized as the father of an illegitimate child, born to Judith in Jan 1850. (This of course would be Amanda/Eve, although the child was not named.) This case was also apparently dropped.

A third case was filed 12 Aug 1859 by Sarah Jane. No case record appears in the file. This case was dismissed 8 Oct 1859.

A fourth case was filed 13 Mar 1862, this time by Liberty. He claims that Sarah Jane has abandoned and deserted him. Sarah Jane contests this stating that Liberty wants the divorce so he can marry Judith. She also states that both Liberty and Judith were arrested for assault with intent to murder her. Liberty was not tried. But Judith was tried, convicted and sent to prison. She was since released. She states that Liberty lived with Judith up until the conviction and again moved in with Judith when she was released. This case was dismissed 21 Jan 1865.

It would seem from these records that Liberty had a relationship with Judith beginning perhaps in 1846 and extending, perhaps off and on, for at least 16 years. It would also seem that Liberty is indeed the father of Eve/Amanda. (We can be certain that Norman is not the father.)

We also do not find a record of a completed divorce from Sarah Jane or a marriage to Judith. However, Liberty certainly had a lengthy relationship with Judith, which apparently resulted in a child.

The parentage of Maria/Mariah should be listed as Norman and Judith. Although not impossible, there is simply no evidence of a relationship between Judith and Liberty prior to 1846.--Rfelsing 01:37, 25 November 2014 (UTC)

Wow - that's quite a story. Were you planning on merging the records for Amanda and Eve? I could do it if you are not comfortable doing a merge (although it should not be very hard in this case). If I did it, I would probably assume her name was Amanda Eve Irish. I also think some of this divorce info should go on the family page of Liberty and Sarah Jane. It is quite interesting. Unless, of course, there is still sensitivity on this issue amongst the descendants, and you think it should not be front-and-center.--DataAnalyst 03:05, 25 November 2014 (UTC)