Place talk:Toronto, York, Ontario, Canada

Places listed as "Alternate Names" [10 July 2012]

I have now redirected Place:Toronto, Ontario, Canada back into Place:Toronto, York, Ontario, Canada, having moved Contained Places first.

The following places are given as alternate names for Toronto:

  • Fort Rouillee. French fort existed in 18th century, abandoned 1769.
  • York. Name of Toronto 179? - 1834
  • Yorkville. separate village immediately north of Toronto, part of York Township in 1851, an identifiable census area in York Township 1861 till it was merged with Toronto
  • Brockton. A small village west of Yorkville, not identifiable on censuses before 1871 if then.
  • West Toronto Junction. Not just a railway station, but a large area covered with railway tracks, industry, livestock yard, and people living in houses. In York Township until merged in ????. Identifiable on censuses when?
  • Eglinton. A village north of Yorkville, but separated from it by a ravine which could be unnavigable by horse and cart December through May. I notice another village, Davisville, is listed in York. Davisville is in between Yorkville and Eglinton.
  • North Toronto. Eglinton became North Toronto (the common parlance name changed) as it grew northward. Not part of Toronto until after 1911.
  • East Toronto. Called Little York in the mid-1800s. A census division in 1911.
  • Parkdale. South of West Toronto Junction facing Lake Ontario. In York Township 1861. Afterwards to be checked.
  • Humber Bay. Beyond Parkdale. The name of a very small community about 1840. Eventually the area became the smallest village that joined Toronto in 1953, but then it was called Swansea. The only reason Humber Bay is in WR is that it was the name of the local LDS congregation and its list of members in 1910 is in WR sources, i.e., it's no different than calling a church by a saint's name.

None of these places are listed separately. I believe that all ought to be with the exception of Fort Rouillee, York, and possibly Humber Bay (which could be completely deleted).

But, how do we find the people pages that ought have their references to the new place pages adjusted?

I had a look at New York City for comparison. Alternate names there include "The Big Apple" and NYC, but not, say, "The Bowery". The list for Toronto omits Muddy York, Hogtown, Metro and T-O or TO, which were/are commonly used and describe the whole city. --goldenoldie 02:46, 5 July 2012 (EDT)

Not knowing anything about Toronto, I concur that according to your analysis, the following ought to be separate place pages:

  • Yorkville
  • Brockton
  • Eglinton == North Toronto
  • Davisville
  • East Toronto == Little York
  • Parkdale
  • Humber Bay (size isn't what matters, just separate community. The nucleus of a community can be as simple as a church and a general store.)

I'd say that these pages are for data entry going forward, and there is no need to retroactively reclassify references, except if they happen to be reviewed for some other reason.

(I agree with you that the question of neighborhoods within cities constitutes a totally separate issue which requires resolution WeRelate-wide.)

--Pkeegstra 20:02, 9 July 2012 (EDT)

If you click on the Family History Library Catalog link on this place page, you'll notice the FHLC lists several "Use for" locations. It seems that when the places were originally imported from FHLC, these places were considered "Alt names" instead of a new place page being created for them. This is just a guess, but it is a pattern I'm seeing from working on the NL place pages. So, at times, when there are alt names listed, they are simply names for adjoining small towns whose records could be found in the larger municipality (thus not being a true alt name). So, what I've done is delete the incorrect alt names, and create new places pages for them. --Jennifer (JBS66) 11:45, 10 July 2012 (EDT)

Amalgamating neighbourhoods [7 July 2012]

Wikipedia has this as a topic which will be brought in as a reference, not only in Toronto, but in the places being almalgamated.

I had not found the wiki when I wrote the above topic the other day. --goldenoldie 08:58, 7 July 2012 (EDT)

Revising Toronto [14 August 2012]

I have just completed Phase 1 of the revision.

  • The alternate names which should have been separate communities have been moved out (but their individual descriptions have yet to be done).
  • The general description of Toronto has been condensed from Wikipedia's provision. (I don't believe we need to import the patting-one's-own-back sections of Wikipedia articles.)
  • The history section will also be subjected to a condensation and correction shortly. (I am tempted to do the correcting in Wikipedia.)
  • I have added references to two maps found in Wikimedia Commons (and wish we could import them.)
  • Research Tips have been added, the section "York local provision" is new. I may break it into two sections: one for York Region (a new place I had to add) and one for Toronto.
  • A discussion of late 19th-early 20th century amalgamations relative to the censuses of the time needs doing. This should probably be an "article". Until overall census indexing, such as that on Ancestry and automatedgenealogy, came out it was pretty well impossible to figure out where an ancestor would be found with only the general location of "Toronto". Some census districts were labelled York, some Toronto.--goldenoldie 16:12, 14 August 2012 (EDT)